Empyrion - Galactic Survival

Empyrion - Galactic Survival

⛔ (OBSOLETE) Reforged Eden 1
Shiollei 2023 年 5 月 20 日 上午 11:36
Cargo volume and power do not make any sense
Large Combat Armor Block in Reforged Eden (2m x 2m x 2m) apparently fits into a small backpack (16 litres). I am used to build ships around the principle that it has to lift full cargo of Large Combat Armor Blocks under 1g, but this rule does not make any sense in Reforged Eden since you can cram 30 tons of these blocks in a small container.

What are your rule of thumb for the amount of thrust?

Power requirements for thrusters make even less sense. T1 medium thruster accepts 70 watts of power and outputs 144 kN of thrust. So apparently whoever did this rebalance thought that a hairdryer can lift a loaded truck into the air.

I mean it's worse than vanilla to the point of stretching even a very generous suspension of disbelief.
最后由 Shiollei 编辑于; 2023 年 5 月 20 日 上午 11:39
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正在显示第 1 - 6 条,共 6 条留言
ravien_ff  [开发者] 2023 年 5 月 20 日 下午 2:15 
I am not sure what you are saying.
If you're expecting realistic physics that is not feasible within a scenario with the config options we have available and the way the game plays.
Shiollei 2023 年 5 月 20 日 下午 3:39 
I don't expect realistic physics, of course. I am wondering though what was the point of switching from PU to watts and from SU to litres if that made an already unrealistic system so ridiculously unbelievable?
Vermillion  [开发者] 2023 年 5 月 20 日 下午 4:18 
The game functions in Watts and Liters to begin with. Only in the English localization was the energy and volume system changed, ostensibly to stop people whining that volume and power values aren't realistic.

As it stands, item volumes ARE realistically sized. It is only blocks that are scaled down because you wouldn't be able to store them at all; and players need to be able to store and place a decent amount of them to have any worth at all.

Before you suggest that block mass should scale down with volume: Volume is only relevant to a block as cargo. Mass affects a block as both cargo and when placed on a ship. Scaling the mass down will affect ship mass negatively.

The rule of thumb for thrust is independent of cargo weight and is relative to the average mass of an empty ship of moderate proportions. If cargo is too heavy for your ship, then the fault lies with you for carrying more than is recommended (AKA, you're greedy).
Power consumption by thrusters will not be increased to suit your sense of believability because that will adversely affect gameplay in every other power and fuel-related aspect of the game.
Not every part of the game has adjustable power/fuel ratios, so simply increasing the values of everything to realistic scale won't work without breaking things like Autominers and Solar Panels.
最后由 Vermillion 编辑于; 2023 年 5 月 20 日 下午 4:20
Shiollei 2023 年 5 月 20 日 下午 8:40 
Thank you for the detailed explanation.

I have to admit that PU and SU make the obvious discrepancy not as much in your face.

Let me try to illustrate what I'm talking about. Let's say I am building a starter SV with a very modest (I think you'd agree) cargo of 1000 litres. It's starter, so I am limited to small (ideally) or medium (unlocked at level 7) thrusters.

In stock, it could hold 12 large combat armor blocks (48 tons) and 7 small or 3 medium thrusters to lift them. Seems reasonable.

In Reforged Eden, it could hold 62 of these blocks (235.6 tons) and require 31 small or 17 medium thrusters. Not reasonable, in my opinion, for a starter ship. UHC Dart has 3 small lift thrusters.

I guess large combat armor blocks were used as a measurement because they are the most dense in the game. I remember I got roasted with my first submission to workshop for not heaving enough trust to lift a full cargo hold of these.

I guess 20k cargo hold was a popular value to aim for with SVs. To lift a 20k cargo hold full of these blocks in Reforged Eden, you need 9 of the largest (3x13x3) jet thrusters. You don't need that amount of thrust for anything else in the game.

So if large combat armor blocks are no longer a good metric to measure your craft thrust against, what is? Ore, large functional blocks like refinery?
最后由 Shiollei 编辑于; 2023 年 5 月 20 日 下午 8:41
Warlords Welt 2023 年 5 月 20 日 下午 9:42 
Vanilla ships are not a benchmark for RE. I now have about 1000 hours in RE and 2500 in Vanilla. Last week we played vanilla for fun......omg after 5 days we killed the server and started RE again.
Our ships are nothing but rebuilt vanilla Asteria, Goose and a small launch SV. Now we are adding a custom build. We play on principle only with CPU mass and weight and had no problems at any time. RE is NOT vanilla - you have to learn and keep that in mind.
But come here and say everything is ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥, is not the fine English way no one forces you to play RE.
ravien_ff  [开发者] 2023 年 5 月 21 日 上午 6:27 
引用自 Shiolle
Thank you for the detailed explanation.

I have to admit that PU and SU make the obvious discrepancy not as much in your face.

Let me try to illustrate what I'm talking about. Let's say I am building a starter SV with a very modest (I think you'd agree) cargo of 1000 litres. It's starter, so I am limited to small (ideally) or medium (unlocked at level 7) thrusters.

In stock, it could hold 12 large combat armor blocks (48 tons) and 7 small or 3 medium thrusters to lift them. Seems reasonable.

In Reforged Eden, it could hold 62 of these blocks (235.6 tons) and require 31 small or 17 medium thrusters. Not reasonable, in my opinion, for a starter ship. UHC Dart has 3 small lift thrusters.

I guess large combat armor blocks were used as a measurement because they are the most dense in the game. I remember I got roasted with my first submission to workshop for not heaving enough trust to lift a full cargo hold of these.

I guess 20k cargo hold was a popular value to aim for with SVs. To lift a 20k cargo hold full of these blocks in Reforged Eden, you need 9 of the largest (3x13x3) jet thrusters. You don't need that amount of thrust for anything else in the game.

So if large combat armor blocks are no longer a good metric to measure your craft thrust against, what is? Ore, large functional blocks like refinery?

Combat steel blocks should not be something you haul around often especially in a SV.
Usually you will want to break things down into their actual components so they will be much easier to move around.
I've never carried full hull blocks in a SV. They aren't worth it.
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