@Tom ~ Yea, that is an older part of the description I will update now, heh, from back when I had modified all the existing classes, good catch, thank you. ^.^

As furr allowing classes to get enchantments, the way the game works I need to flag the class as a specific unit type, and those flags can give skills automatically. I did not realize Shield Units get the defenses by default, or maybe they added it at some point? But Skirmishers get Slippery and one other which is why I use skills that already give them to enable those enchantments. Polearm units also get First Strike which is why I only have 1 skill that gives it since the skill gave that one already.

@Zaxori ~ That is a really good point, in fact at the end of my description I mention this mod can be used by AoW4 owners however they like as long as not used furr profit, so I have no problem if another modder wants to grab this and use it to make their own mods, or if someone wanted to update and maintain this one.

In fact, if there is any modder that wants to grab this up and update it please let me know your mod and I will link directly to it here.

I played this mod for the first time yesterday and I really like it. I played with the Ranger, Defender and Warrior classes. I think they are all more enjoyable than the original, and the skill tree is more logically structured. However, I found an interesting bug. If I take the shield unit ability, I not only get the enchantments, but I also immediately get 3 defenses.

Oh, and it is compatible with the "No Conflicting Skills" mod. It removes the locks for the classes that this mod does not modify. I tried it with Elementalist and the skill tree is without locks, while my ranger, warrior and defender characters use this rearranged skill tree.

Thanks for your work and don't let it go!

You know... I was thinking. You should definitely leave this mod up and for two reason. 1. At least for a while, even if one class breaks, it's only one class. All of the rest of the classes work just fine. Small price to pay to be able to use this mod. 2. So long as you don't mind, usually modders also inspire other modders. Someone might see your mod and use it as a base for theirs or even take the time to update it for you. It's a win-win in my opinion.

@Zaxori ~ You are very welcome and I appreciate the kind words. And yea, hehe, most modders I know tend to hope that they inspire developers to make changes, no real way to know in the end, but we can all dream right? ^.^

Yea. Maybe your mod inspired them XD? Ahaha. It was good while it lasted though. Thanks for your time and dedication.

Alright, problems should now be fixed with Ritualist crashing, but I had to go in and remove all of my changes to the class again. At this point I am considering this mod Depreciated, and if they keep making heavy changes to classes I might just take it down (or hide it from public?), thank you everyone for your support and I was very happy with this mod while it lasted, seems its days are quickly coming to an end sadly, but hey, that means they are improving the classes right?

I havne't been playing lately but there wasn't any other class to my knowledge.

Oh hell, le-sigh, I'll have a look, my guess is some of its skills draw upon Mage tree and since I removed all my alterations to it, it is now causing problems. Please let me know if there are problems with any other classes?

I might have to wind up removing alterations to class abilities and just go with moving skills around on the trees.

Thank you for the information, please let me know if there are any other issues.

Crash on Ritualist, yeah

So everything was going fine, but today the ritualist is now crashing the game.

@Zaxori ~ Hmmm, Battlesaint should not be affected at all by this mod, yet, but it draws upon a skill from the Mage file, they like to re-use skills in AoW4 from other classes so that may have been the problem there.

Either way, glad the update fixed the problem, I'll be adding modifications of the three (newish) classes hopefully sooner rather then later, but since this mod will break saved games and Steam can auto-update I want to wait to release a new version until I complete all of them (especially since I am planning to only change the skill trees themselves), to minimize problems can encounter when this mod gets updated.

So far so good! Loaded a new game with specifically an elementalist ruler and it didn't crash when looking at the abilities. I then loaded an already ongoing game, same thing, no crashes. If anything happens I'll let you know!

@wisprr Ah, it wasn't just elementalist heros for me. It was any hero included my ruler (he was a battlesaint and another test game I did the ruler was... I think just a warrior). Regardless, I'll give it a try and see what happens.

@Zaxori ~ There, hotfix uploaded, try to unsubscribe from this mod then re-sub. (Steam sometimes takes a bit to download a patch to a mod.) Hope this helps the problem.

And my Goddess! I see why peeps want an update to this mod, the new class trees are such a mess! *shudders* Alright, I did a hotfix today to remove the crash issue, and I will work on the three new classes over time but will try not to put it off too much, I did hop in-game (with no mods loaded) to gather the info i needed to make updates and change skill trees.

@Zaxori ~ From your description I do not think it is a mod conflict actually, someone else mention that my mod causes a crash when trying to load an Elementalist Hero screen, something I am working on fixing right now actually, just a quick patch to this mod to completely remove all changes to the original Mage class that got changed into Elementalist. At present my launcher crashes when I try to bring up the list of mods, so I either need to find another way to upload the update or removing all my installed mods might help, we'll see here in a few minutes.

These are the newly added mods:
Tome of Shifting Sands
Build within the Umbral Abyss
Archon Prophecy Von Mod DLC Content
Corvo's Voidlings Overhaul
TB-Society Traits
Ultimate Undead

Hopefully that helps

OH I'm so sorry I should have totally said that prior. So what made me THINK it was a hero related issue is because whenever I would try to inspect a hero, the game would immediate crash. It's weird because I had the game working just fine for a day, but when I checked to see if it was maybe a newer mod I installed, the game worked fine. How I pinpointed your mod was I went through and turned off every mod that I installed when I picked the game back up. It only worked when I turned off your mod. I tried starting new matches, trying different races, every time I tried to inspect a hero it immediatly just crashed. I did also suspect that maybe it was a aesthetic mod, since it crashes at the inspection screen, but I am unsure. Let me list all of the newer mods I installed. Just as a reminder, I did have your mod working before, so I doubt that it's the one of the older mods I had installed, but I don't have a way of confirming.

@Zaxori ~ None of the mods that add new classes, like Kaige's, conflict with this mod since they do not alter the core classes at all, they add completely new files so conflicts are not possible. And it is why I list which of the base game files I modify, but not everyone does that. I did mention in the description this mod does not work at all with certain other mods, and I know there is a conflict with the Unofficial Patch mod since it changes the description of a deathknight skill, and loading this mod after it fixes the problem.

The real question is, does loading my mod after all your other mods fix the problem? Or does doing that break other things in another mod that are important? What problem(s) is the conflict causing? That might help to narrow it down. But there might be no way to fix the problem, I went out of my way to modify the minimum number of base game files I could.

Hey so I can't quite pinpoint which mod is causing a conflict with your mod, but for sure there is another mod out there that conflicts with yours. I would love to tell you which one it is but I have way too many mods to really tell which it is. I have confirmed that it is your mod and something else though. I would suspect one of my class mods would be the most likely culprit, since mods editing common stuff tend to conflict. So maybe Kaige's multiclass mod?

omg yippey ! sounds like it might be good news ^ ^

yea if you find the time and motivation to return to it, then i'll be here to play with it. but if you lack the interest then that's ofc okay

Thank you for the info, will confirm Battlesaint is DLC exclusive but that's fine I can easily set it up so vanilla players can still use this mod. Also see the new warlock file, no new Elementalist file so my guess is it just using the old mage one instead.

I'll have to get off my duff one of these days to do a 'light' pass-through update just rearranging the new skill trees without any actual skill changes that way I will not have to playtest myself, and the newer classes seem pretty well balanced anywise. My guess for the game crash is probably because Elementalist (formerly mage) references skills and possible info that is no longer there.

No new Before and After here though, since I won't even have to logg into the game to shuffle around the skill trees.

I'll keep you updated when I do get around to updating. Thanks again for all the information, I did not even realize Mage was split and there was a new core class. ^.^

yea so, to answer some questions: the new battlesaint class has a little "AP" DLC tag on it, when you select it for your ruler, so i suspect it's exclusive.

(also, they also reworked the old mage classes. changing two and adding one that's new. so ritualist, "elementalist" (changed from mage) and the new warlock class.)

i did some limited testing and it seems all the old vanilla classes still work with this mod! however, if you try to open your hero tab as one of the mage classes, the game will crash ;(. so you could technically use the mod still, if you fully avoid recruiting mage heroes.

after having tried your mod, i can't imagine going back to the vanilla skill tree stucture ;_; but if you're not interested in returning atm that's ok! you have no obligation to do anything :3

Ive played just once with your mod and I quite enjoy it, so much so that I was intending on waiting an update to actually play the DLC. The new class is dlc exclusive btw. Balance is fine!

Oh, wait, it is already out, my bad, I thought it was going to release on August 22nd, my bad, probably was the 12th wasn't it? lol

Either way, what do people think, how should I handle this? Also, does all the previous modifications still function properly? Finally, the new class, does it require the new DLC or can everyone use it?

@Epic Meow ~ First and foremost, Mew!! =D

Secondly, I was actually working on another mod for a while there, to add a new class, but hit several setbacks (had to completely remake it 1 time to fix one glitch, and when I finished that it just crashed the game), so got very frustrated and have dove into other games.

That said, I do feel a responsibility to this mod and feel I should update for the new class that is coming out in a week here, but do not really have much of a desire to play and do an actual playtest of my modifications, I could put something together and let the community do the testing, but I don't get very much feedback here on problems or even balance, so what does everyone here think?

By the way, does anyone know if the new class requires the DLC that is coming out (I already own it), or will it be released to all players even if they do not own the DLC?

hiiiii, any chance you'd revisit this? for the griffon update stuff :3

ho, maybe where i saw the artstyle, but near no chance to find them without a name, it quite full, and many have leaved, that web site isn't what it used to be, it quite sad, what DA as become, full of ia bullshit

I got this custom art quite some time ago, Mab did it and I hear she is still around on Deviant Art.

i see, who the artist that made the art for you ? maybe i saw their art before and lost them, appen to some artist i liked before making account on art cite to more easily find them

and the rest interesting

@Lounna ~ Most of the art is in-game base art from AoW4.

* Everything in-game is unmodified base game assets.

* The cover-image for the mod has different elements:
The background with the feline is custom art made specifically for me. (Which I made my avatar for Steam from.)
The silhouette on the bottom is the Seattle skyline which I modified some, because you know Structures and I love that skyline.
The icons on top are the class symbols for each of the modified classes.
The larger icons on the bottom are different abilities from each of the modified classes.

where do the art you use come from ? it feel familiar, but do not remember where i seen it

@Solack ~ You are very welcome, like a lot of modders I make mods for myself and then share them in case others may like them, but in addition to that for me it really means a lot that others use and enjoy my work, I really appreciate it and your comments. ^.^

And yea, as many games as I have played over the years I thought it was rather silly how in AOW4 you quite frequently buff abilities before you can even get them. In my Ritualist playthrough after I altered them I actually wound up using Battlefield Restoration much more frequently early game then I did mid to late as I unlocked more abilities to use. Late game I would save it until after units took damage and I had the support buff that heals.

@Wisprr Gotcha thanks for the explanation on the Unit Enchantments issue, makes sense and I had a feeling it was that way! Little sad it doesnt work but technical limitations are technical limitations haha.

Thinking of it more I have to agree I think it feels much better to be able to get the abilities early, and than need to invest additional points in the tree to make them to their full potential. Compared to the Vanilla method that is essentially the opposite haha. Thanks again for the mod, really been enjoying it :)

@Solack ~ Yea, that was the largest buff to Ritualist I did, was to allow all three Support buffs, which are not too powerful individually, and many other classes allow for multiple buffs on a certain type of skills, but to get those enhancers I burried them on purpose so that they do require investment of skill points instead of the abilities themselves.

Regarding your Unit Enchantments question, the way the game is set up this mod will not allow More Classes to bestow them on characters, even for abilities shared between classes. (However, my altered descriptions for those shared abilities may display unless the mod uses custom descriptions of its own.)

And yes, I love the Battlefield Restoration ability too, but I tried to set it up so that all abilities are meaningful enough to still use them, I mean, what is the point of being forced to take Restore early on only to have it never be used at later levels because a later ability is just better?

@Wisprr Interesting that you felt that Ritualist is a bit underpowered compared to where you would like her. I think the main thing for me is the ability to get Battlefield Restoration early and then grabbing Bolstering Resistance, Healing Support and Regeneratting Support all together. It just makes for an incredibly powerful AoE healer. you combine it with for example the Industrious culture or any decent sources of bolstered defense as well and have a very strong combo.

Also side note: I see you are also using Kaige's More Classes in your publically available collection. I was wondering if when you are using his classes along with your mod installed (loading your mod last) do Unit Enchantments apply to his added classes for you? Cause they do not for me.

Honestly I felt like Ritualist could use a bit of buffing compared to other classes, especially since I had just done Mage right before it, since playing Ritualist before my adjustments felt underwhelming a bit, its funny, doing my Warrior playthrough I had a ritualist hero and did not really give her support or damage sakills and set her up as a summoner, which was a lot of fun.

Have to say, Ritualist is good for choosing different interesting paths, but their number of skills to choose from feels a little thin to me, and they have a lot of abilities they can use in combat while some other classes have very few.

Quite enjoying the changes you made so far, though some of them are definitely a bit OP it feels, specifically looking at you ritualist. being able to get those strong support abilities almost immediately feels really strong, though not unfun.

Thanks for sharing it!

Fantastic changes you've made with your mod. Very fun to play. Normally I'd say something is at the top of my list, but with how mod loading order works, your's is the last mod on my list cause I want to ensure it takes priority. Thank you for all the time and effort you put into this, looking forward to see what your next mod brings to the game !!

@Grath ~ Thank you very much, if you have played with my alterations I would love to hear what you think about how it feels.
@Shifter ~ I actually had a friend say the same thing about a different class I did. My answer to them was that Abilities are not all that powerful, it is the passive skills you unlock that makes them stronger, so in a way taking them all slows down how quickly you become powerful in a class with over 40 skills.

But if you love Ranger and have played it a lot, I would adore feedback from people that have actually played the original and then played these altered ones so I know how it feels to others.

Oh, and I wish all the classes had over 40 skills lol! ^.^ I hope that answers your question, and when I did my ranger playthrough it felt good to me.

Good work! Skill trees can always be improved from the original, IMO. I too am looking forward to the remaining classes.

Heya, so out of curiosity, like with the ranger that I recently played around with, is having access to all three shot abilities somewhat OP? And I do like the layout, but should some skills have some sort of level lock or requirement? As having access to everything from the beginning might be... Easy for players or even AI to abuse?

@Everyone ~ I play my modified classes after every update, but I do not use all of the skills, so any that use this mod if you can please let me know of any bugs or glitches I would greatly appreciate it. And thank you for using my work, it means a lot to me. ^.^

Wow 1000 character limit to comments, lets try again....
@Shifter ~ Thank you for posting a comment, I really appreciate it. As for more classes, they are definitely not needed, but they help a lot so things do not get monotonous when starting a new campaign. I use the More Classes too and my favorite from that is Necromancer since I loved the class in AoW3 and was sad to not see it in 4. I also use the Grim Jester which I really love since it is fun and very distinctive.

Heya, love the alterations! In your personal opinion, do you think other classes are needed beyond the base games' (with your alterations, of course) ones? I'm using Kaige's More Classes mod, and while I appreciate the additional choices, I think the only one I really liked and wanted to keep was the Cryomancer since it was missing from the hero line up, the other added classes from the mod, could fall back from/into the originals.

Whelp, at 4 of the 7 original classes restructured, now to play Spellblade (actually my first time using it ^.- ) to see how it feels to me, I also made a few name tweaks to previous classes since they were bothering me.

Plus, I finally updated my 'banner image' to show the classes I've completed, snazzy me! Well, if you are familiar with what those icons are, heh. >.>

greatly enjoying it so far and can't wait to see where the other classes go.

@prokyon ~ Thank you, it is much appreciated! takes me a few days before I work on the next class, since I like to go and play the class I just modified to see how it feels, thus the minor update yesterday I did to Ritualist making a few minor adjustments.

Now I do not use all of the skills (one of the points of this mod, I really hate a cluttered skill bar in combat with hundreds of active skills I never use -.- ), so if you use this mod and think anything needs a tweak please let me know, I try to keep things balanced and in-line with the core game power level so my adjustments should not make anything too insane, in some occasions I actually reduce the power level of a skill, but that is pretty rare. So just let me know if you feel something could use an adjustment.

Great work! I'm very looking forward for you to complete this work and have all classes restructured!