I recommend reading Tacitus's 'Germania'. He provides an excellent description of the dynamics of the continental Germanic peoples, for example noting that family and marriage are sacred and that the rate of adultery is similar to the crime rate in Japan. If adultery did occur, it was severely punished, sometimes resulting in banishment from the tribe.

For Heathenry I would recommend leaning into the Anglo Saxon pagan belief: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anglo-Saxon_paganism#Mythology

The names of the gods are anglesised versions of the Norse gods and so the overlap between the faiths are there. I would agree that the building of henges didn't hold the same place in their faith and so there is probably an argument for replacing it with Ritual Celebrations as the AS Pagans were reported by Bede to celebrate the turning of the seasons.

why call Wica Heathenry? if you're going for the English Germanic paganism then they didn't build henges to worship in, they just had sacred groves, it wasnt gender equal, theodism itself exists and is reconstuctionist faith that inputs modern values into an old religion. Which is fine in itself but entriely non-historical. Additionally, your holy sites are all Brythonic outside of Kent. Sure Hengest and Horsa were like folk heros but not to the Britons and Roman Britons in Britain.

How about, please shut up @The Victorianist? It's just a mod for a video game. It's not that deep. XD

Great Mod

@alfie

1. Life is political.

2. @The Victorianist didn't drag politics into it first. @Ġedryht of Wōden did, but I am sure that you only got mad at The Victorianist because he insulted your team on the political aisle.

@The Victorianist

How do you manage to drag politics into this? If nothing you are the degenerate here.

Seek help.

I am curious as to whether or not you changed the virtues of the various 'Paganisms,' especially seeing as the current ones are questionable at best, at least for the Germanic ones. Might I also ask where you determined that 'Heathenry' would have gender-equal and homosexuality accepted? I see no reason to suspect why the Anglo-Saxons/English would be more liberal in that regard when compared to their mainland kinsmen, I am just curious, as we know very little about Anglo-Saxon/English paganism, assuming that is, your takes on 'Heathenry' aren't creative liberties.

@Woden Warrior

Most Pagan faiths in Europe never had a name like "Christianity","Islam","Judaism","Shinto","Buddhism" and so on.

A lot of the names we have for them appeared in the 20th century.
Polytheistic reconstructionism/contemporary paganism use these made up names for ancient religions. We have no sources stating a name for these religions.

The only word which was used was Paganism before the 20th century, it was used since the 4th century in the Roman Empire by the early Christians. So that word is much more historically correct than any other name which appeared hundreds of years later.

To note: I see more Rightist degenerates who use shows like the Vikings TV shows as a source.

@Woden Warrior
While there is definitely a new "pop history" surrounding viking attitudes, the idea that they're in-line with contemporary 1800s anglo values is equally ahistorical. Reactionaries are themselves also modernist, so

This should be renamed Paganism according to Leftist Degenerates whose source is the Vikings TV show.

It would be interesting if the Phoenician or Punic religion were added.

May I suggest changing the name of the mod to "More Diverse Paganism" or "More Varied Paganism"? The "historic" term is bound to draw debate to the comments, and the variety this mod adds is awesome just for the gameplay-side alone imo.

For god names you can just use the norse gods and give them their central germanic names. (note, the names depend on which part of Germany we were talking about. The Saxons used different names than the Franks for example)

Odin - Wotan
Thor - Donar
Tyr - Ziu

Freyr could be Fol/Phol
Fulla/Volla is her sister in german paganism (not norse i believe)

There are some names of central germanic gods in trhe "Merseburger Zaubersprüche" (Merseburger spells) since they include poetry of central germanic paganism.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Merseburg_charms

Nerthus could be the predecessor of the norse Njörðr

ofcourse most of the ways to find those names are in german only

There is also an argument to be made to split "Irminism" into a saxon/low german and frankish/allemanic/bavarian/upper german variant since there were some differences however this would finidng holy sites even more difficult.

I should also add that Kænugarðr is a weird choice as a holy site for any germanic faith. It had no major relevancy to any germanic faith

example:

Irminsul (paderborn)

Donar's Oak (Kassel. This sacred oak was destroyed by the missionary Bonifacius in the 8th century. It is believed to have stood at the village Geismar near Fritzlar, modern day Hessen.)

Grove of Nerthus (probably on the danish island of Sjaeland. Roskilde maybe)

Grove of Beduhenna (somewhere in ancient Frisia. Tacitus wrote that a roman legion was defeated there)

Grove of the Semnones (Tacitus writes that the Semnones had a sacred grove where they worshipped a "supreme god". Since they lived between the rivers of Elbe and Oder in Saxony/Brandenburg it should be around this area somewhere)

Regarding central germanic holy sites I would suggest locations of sacred groves. Wikipedia has a list of some important ones.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sacred_trees_and_groves_in_Germanic_paganism_and_mythology
I'd suggest moving all "Irminist" holy sites from England and the Ukrainian one closer to Germany.

Okay! Mod should now be working with 1.13.0

Hey, everyone. Just to let you all know, this mod wont be compatible with 1.13.0 at launch, since there is a new bookmark being added. I’ll try to get the history fixed as quickly as possible, and hopefully have it fixed by Thursday. I’m going to try to update the workshop page to reflect this.

if you claim to have "more historical pagans", you should def also provide the sources for your changes first and foremost in my opinion.

i certainly wouldn't expect it from a guy who is extrapolating conclusions about the social attitudes of all greek poleis as a near-monolithic whole—certainly, on a cultural and social level, not the way the peoples of said poleis thought about it until at least the 7th-3rd centuries BCE at the very earliest—based on "various ancient city laws" (what, like the hellenic world was just a very decentralized country rather than hundreds or thousands of disparate polities?)

@captain_crush i strongly doubt you're going to get any honest conversation with this guy about issues such as anachronistic common-law-tainted interpretations of customary law or whether our idea of "what old norse germanics believed" might perhaps be centrally affected by not just the cultural but also *legal* christianization of the north that was entirely in swing prior to any of the *extant* "first-hand sources" we are supposedly drawing from in extrapolating conclusions about the norms of pre-christianization nordic societies

@captain_crush With all due respect, I have already mentioned several authentic first-hand sources from this time-period which mentions this and is also available for you to study since these are historical documents. I'm Scandinavian myself and have read these, If you are interested and want to be as historically accurate as possible then you should look them up and see for yourself. Not sure why you would need modern second-hand sources that simply refer to these exact historical sources that i've already mentioned.

The only sources I can find all say that someone accused of being argr could be declared nithing, argr referring to being effeminate or weak, based on acts in the bedroom. This doesn’t apply to men who were more aggressive during homosexual acts (indifferent), or women, who were more likely to be accused of being promiscuous (shunned). Please, if you can, provide me a source with academic backing, sourced information, in MLA citation style, so that I can look at it myself and make a call as to how it should be handled. If you can’t, I don’t feel confident in changing anything until someone can.

@captain_crush Gulaþing law of Norway, Frostathing law of Norway, Grágás Icelandic law. Are some examples of Norse laws. And if you look at the word "Nīþ"(Niding). Is a status that in Old Norse that meant "outlaw or ostracized". This status would be branded upon criminals, including anyone comitting homosexual or perverted acts. So Homosexuality and Deviancy. They were stripped of everything they owned and deemed dead by everyone, including their own family and kin. Then thrown out into the woods all alone. If they somehow survived that, it was acceptable and even considered your duty as a man to kill them, if you encountered them. And as mentioned before, this is an old thing and a continuation of the bog executions that Tacitus mentions.

@Hermóðr

edit: I apologize for in my previous post claiming that effeminacy was not criminal- it was, and that would be grounds for a holmgang.

I would very much like to see your sources about that. I can find evidence of persecuted homosexuality in, for example, England at that time, but can only find references to effeminacy being treated poorly by the Norse. Let alone the idea that active homosexual men or homosexual women where persecuted for their sexuality. What we do know of Old Norse culture is very limited, but what little we do have paints a picture of a culture that looks down on men acting like women, and it is for this reason that homosexuality was looked down upon at all.

@captain_crush Actually there's quite alot of evidence. Homosexuality was historically a crime punishable by death, Even being called one as i stated before, was a serious insult and anyone who were accused for being homosexual were expected to defend themselves. This is stated and very evident in various historical scripts. In no reliable source do they paint an acceptant view towards homosexuality or deviancy. It was viewed as degenerative even to masturbate or have sex before the age of 20 for men. The Germanics were very strict in their social codes, more so than during the christian era. Greeks also weren't "passive" about it either. That's a modern myth. It's stated in various ancient city laws, that anyone comitting homosexual acts were stripped of their rights. As well as being branded "kinaidos" which means "those who bring shame". Basically becoming outcasts and dead to society.

@Hermóðr I'm not too familiar with the works of Tacitus, but do know that what little evidence we have of the practices of the northern pagans paints a picture of them quite similar to Greek pagans in terms of homosexuality- notably "passive" men would be looked down on as effeminate, while no such accusation was made of more "active" participants. Unfortunately, "bottom" isn't a trait in ck3, and you don't have the "indifferent" homosexuality setting from after the end, so I deferred to making homosexuality accepted. I would be open to making it shunned in the future if I get enough feedback from people about it, but currently I think it works well enough. I will consider changing the doctrine of the continental pagans based on that Tacitus quote though.

Just want to point out that deviancy and homosexuality changed to being accepted is quite non-historical and makes no sense for Germanic religions since in Norse society it was one of the worst things you could be branded as, anyone accused of it was expected to defend their honour in a Holmgång(duel). And in Germany there are several records describing quite clearly that "they were drowned in the slimy mud of a swamp" - Tacitus on the Germanic pagans in his book Germania. Tacitus also includes Scandinavia in his writings and the Romans considered Scandinavia as part of Magna Germania so this includes the Scandinavian pagans as well.