Update: I got it working again, and I must say, this is a great mod. My only possible complaints are that rangers seem to be unlocked a little bit too late, and explorers are extremely OP when you upgrade them early via a tribal village.

Damn, the mod stopped working right when I was about to heavily involve recon units in my army. I don't know what other mod might be conflicting with it, Perhaps one that tweaks tech trees? I'll do some testing. Great mod, by the way. Recon units are underutilized by the bulk of the civ fanbase, even in civ 6 where they can be upgraded to be viable weapons.

Does this mod give scouts experience towards gaining promotions for doing what they are naturally designed to do, exploring?

Yeah, there is a bug with the "I See Dead People" promotion that Special Forces units. They seem to cause culture borders to not provide visiblity or for workers to lose thier sight and become invisible. As we will have to wait for the dev to fix this we will have to avoid useing any units that have this ability as it doesnt seem to work as intended.

My Special forces unit is blind of adjacent tiles. what they can see is random and they disappear from my view as well? whats up?

does this work for multiplayer xxxx

I'm using this mod with lower xp need for level up and Expanded Promotions, and for some reason, after i choose a especialization to the scout, it stops winning xp after combat
Any ideas why?

Mod Request: Adds a building to the game. THE SCOUTING SHACK
Available after Pottery

GRANTS SURVIVALISM 1 & 2 to scouts trained in this city.

Cost 100 Hammers

Info: Double the production cost of Barracks. Hard to build early game makes it a tough decision but if a player opts for The Scouting Shack it will pay it’s reward especially after a regular Barracks is constructed.

ok! update! i think i've figured out enough of this moddery to make the changes i would like. i intend to do this using your mod as a base. would it be alright if i publish it to the workshop (never done that before... it may not ever happen)?

i would, of course, give you full credit for the core of the idea. if you would rather i not do so, i will just keep it to myself.

either way, thanks for making such a great mod!

hello! i'm REALLY liking the idea behind this mod, but i'm having some balancing issues. typically, i would fix this kind of stuff to my own liking, but i'm new to modding civ5, and i haven't yet figured out how.

specifically, i have noticed that out of the box, the scout is about 20% STRONGER than a warrior. imo, it should be at least 30% weaker. likewise, it seems from the description that lategame SF units are far more powerful when defending. again, i am of the opinion that such a unit should be offensive, not defensive.

it seems that the culprit is Big Muscles. i realize this goes against your design concept, so i won't ask you to change yours, but if you could point me in the direction of how to mod units, i would appreciate it. thank you!

could you possibly change the special forces name cause theres another addon that adds special forces it would just simply make it less confusing

Scouts with Terrain Expert Mountain can walk on coast (but not ocean.) and don't take damage for ending the turn there. The scout I noticed it on had survivalism promotions if it helps.

Nvmd I figured it out.

I can not find this mod in my mod list even after subscribing. Any ideas how I can fix this?

It works well! Very good idea! Thank you! Cela marche très bien! C'est aussi une très bonne idée! Merci beaucoup! !Marcha muy bien! !También es una buena idea! Mucha gracias! Het werkt prima! Het is ook een goed idee! Bedankt!

Oh and cost:
Relative to regular infantry unit (e.g.: Warrior) of the same tech tier:
100% / 110% / 125% / 150%

hm. Reasonable I guess. You can't really read their stats from a pedia page though (the raw stats aren't representative)
Their strengths are 10 / 15 / 20 with a slight modifier when defending (x3 / x4 / x5)
Ranger and SF get Ranged attack (Strength 20 / 40) and are as invisible as submarines are.
Scouts of all tiers have access to blitz
Improved movement for the new tiers (3 / 4 / 5)
Improved vision for the new tiers (3 / 4 / 6)
SF Get Recon
Terrain Expert promotions: After doing the base promotions to Rank 3 you can choose those, with various terrain specific benefits (Like crosing mountains or vastly inreased LoS while embarked, etc.)

Well ... I didn't add new models, so they look the same as the one's I've stolen from. While defending they are about as strong as unpromoted contemporary units that don't cost strategic resources, but are more expensive. All things that don't screenshot well.

The scout tiers fill a strategic role, providing you with a versatile recon/sabotage unit that feels great to use (I've screenshoted line of sight and walking on mountains, you'll have to take my word on the invisibility part - the game doesn't show the difference for your own units).

So ... sorry, but I don't see what meaningful screenshot I've missed.

Oh, it should work alright. "The Chosen Few" cannot be selected - it comes automatically with the Ranger and Special Forces units, as only they have ranged attacks.

I subscribed to more mods recently, then randomly noticed scouts progress was working and it had big muscles and such. Still don't know how to get "the chosen few" upgrade to unlock sniper but aside from that everything's working.
I think it was due to the Social Policy Rebalancing mod, as it's the only one I didn't have active this time.

Hi BlahBlah,

this may very well be an incompatibility. Do you have another mod installed that affects scouts? While scouts would never get a ranged attack, they do start out with Big Muscles.

Can you check this by starting a new game with only this mod loaded? If it persists, try reinstalling the mod (just remove it from the mods folder, it should automatically be reloaded).

Another possible problem may be that another mod has corrupted data, which may cause the game to stop loading mods after this. If loading only SP works, try adding additional mods until it fails again. Using this method you can narrow down the culprit, remove it and have the game reload a working copy.

Cheers,
Bosparan

I think I have incompatable mods installed- the scout i start with never gets a ranged attack/ability to cross mountians/etc. I've tried going through survivalism 3 and getting the sight upgrades but i never saw anything like big muscles or a ranged attack.
Or am I doing something wrong here?

It says Multiplayer: yes on the in game info screen for the mod, but I only have single player option...

Actually very well done - makes the scout viable long-term for those annoying barbarian hunts. If the barbs have serious firepower the Explorer or Ranger can get far enough away to to stay out of trouble while your heavier, slower troops arrive. Once they get there they can swoop back in for the flanking bonus.

[2 / 2]
...

Another aspect of it is the territory defense role: In late game that's the job of XCom troopers with their insane paradrop ability. That's one of the things I keep most watch out for: The scout tier's role is recon / sabotage. I did not want to create a unit that effectively replaces an existing one.

If tere's some demand for it, I might add another SP extension mod that adds that though ...

Cheers,
Bosparan

[1 / 2]

Hi m4ti140,

the gold cost is intentional: Not only is cutting corners and throwing money at it less effective for special forces than for lowly grunts, I also wanted to prevent reactive instant recruitment. If I hadn't raised hurry gold costs it would have been an incredibly effective way to do deep perimeter defense: Just pop out a SF whenever you need a highly versatile defender and that's that.

I considered doing the paradrop but finally decided against it. A case of how many goodies in how small a package. Especially given how hard they already are to hunt down, allowing them to paradrop would have been excessive in my opinion (and their high mobility somewhat compensates for it).

[...]

For some reason unit costs (in gold) are ridiculously high, Special Forces Cost 3470 g, Rangers half of that.

Also could be nice if SF could paradrop.

Regarding Compatibility patches:

If you find a compatibility issue with another mod, now's the time to step up and tell me, so I can fix it in the V6 release.

Known Issues so far:
- System names of the SP content may cause incompatibility with similarly named content from other mods (notably: Special Forces are not uncommon)
- Promotions Expansion Mod: Promotion Prerequisites

I'll be researching other scouting mods on my own and consider compatibility upgrades (But many out there are simply there to do the same thing SP does - offer advancement paths from the basic version - which makes coexistence pointless).

Cheers

hi dominickane,

glad you like the mod. The interaction between the two mods is as follows:
- Survivalism and Scouting Skills require the Promotions Expansion Mod's unlockers (Which means it'll take 6 levels to reach the final promotions for scouts)
- The Sniper Promotion does not require the unlockers, thus they work as intended by me

This means that right now, the first two tiers (Scouts/Explorers) will be directly impacted no matter what in that the final promotions are far harder to reach. The final two tiers (Rangers / SpecOps) are not impacted in the same way if you choose the Sniper Promotion path.

I'll probably be able find the time to release V6 at the end of August with these features:

- 5th Scout tier (Between Scout and Explorer), to fix the Goodie-Hut Promotion imbalance
- Minor AI Upgrades in using Scout Tier units.
- Compatibility patches to some other mods

If I find something else that's reasonably simple to do and needs doing, I will consider doing it.

Great mod, just one question; How would this mod interact with the Promotions Expansion Mod? :http://psteamcommunity.yuanyoumao.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=84863495

Would that mod overwrite the promotions available for the scouts, or would scouts/explorers/rangers/SpecOps still use their intended promotions from this mod?

Hi Guys,
glad you like the mod, thanks.

@Nano Charat: I've checked out the Unlimited barbarian EXP Mod. There's absolutely no interaction between both mods. If a part of your game breaks after loading two data mods (neither mod changes game logic, only adds/changes settings values) this is usually an indictation of corruption:
Either the mod-data is corrupted or your game is. Try removing both mods from your mod folder (they'll both be redownloaded as long as the subscription exists, savegames will keep working). If this does not work (at least for new games), the only fix I know is reinstallation (ugh).

Wish this was part of the game

Just a note; there seems to be a conflict between this and the "unlimited barbarian exp" mod, such that when both are enabled the tech tree is bugged and techs can't be selected. I just thought you might be interested; not expecting a fix or anything. Love the mod~

srry for the late reply. i have been playing WoW and ESO the past month, and doing school stuff win between, i have not thoought bout this game till tonite. i think i deleted the mod form my harddrive, as i cant find scouts progress or even heights power.

it "ought" to work. Some tooltips may be wrong (survivalism most notably), but by and large it should work. However the mod was designed with the Gamebalance of G&K and BnW in mind, so I can't promise balanced gameplay.

will this mod work on the standard civalization or is only for the expansens

Hi Jak, sorry to hear it didn't work. When you check your mods folder, is Scout's Progress present there? If yes: As a folder or as a file?
Why I changed it? For balance reasons. I try to keep things balanced, not to create an overpowered unit. Some people prefer having an overpowered unit, which is why I created height of power. For more details on what I changed and why I did it, check out the discussions for this mod, I explained it in detail in the Patchnotes thread.

no luck:( just wondering, why did you change it? i personally thought the mod was fine the way it was

@Satrap of Balkh: Thanks for testing this error. I've created a bug-report discussion. It'll be easier to read I hope :)

@Bosparan: This is a continuation from mid-January (see Jan 15 @ 12:54 for your last comment. I tried unloading all mods but Scouts' Progress, I tried it with Mod Test Helper, I tried starting a no-mods game then going back to SP mod (with / wo MTH), and I tried various civs and map sizes and game rates. I saw a few odd things when going back and forth from non-mod to modded games: the promotions dialog appears for the beginning units, the promotion images are red circles with cross-bar, and clicking the promotions takes you to various info screens (Demographics, Economic info, victory progress, ect). Is there a way I can inspect some xml files before and after I've loaded the mods? Any other tips? Thanks!

It would be fairly trivial to demolish their melee defense but maintain their ranged defense ("fairly trivial" = 1-2 Minutes of work with no chance of error). However I specifically want to maintain their melee defense. Game mechanically this means they can survive, but still can't deal decisive damage when attacking (though I'll admit the SF can be a major nuissance. They are fairly expensive in return). Lore wise - when did occupation forces ever actually get rid of Guerillas? People still are dying to in Afghanistan and Iraq if I remember my news correctly. Come to think of it, the Sowjets got thrown out of Afghanistan altogether a few decades back.
No, I think lorewise they make sense as they are and - discounting that early game balance issue for goody-hut - I think the balance is fairly ok.

In my dreams, I'd want scouts/explorers/etc to be fairly strong vs ranged like they are, but really weak vs melee. That way, they'd represent light infantry or guerilla resistance fighters--you can bomb them all you want, but it's going to require an actual ground invasion to get rid of them. Kinda like Syrian rebels these days. But I have no idea whether that sort of thing is possible via modding.

I was thinking you could just tone down the "Tough as Nails" promotions? Otherwise, the Shoshone are going to take over the world...There really shouldn't be a unit ever that can survive more than 3-4 hits from a city, but in my last game, the explorer was only taking 10 dmg each time (and healing 20 >.<) but in addition to that, the 3rd option below looks good.

@orlu_: Thanks for pointing that out, I really ought to have caught that. I can only plead mitigating circumstances: My playing style does not lead to early conflict (I'm an industrialist with a turtle-mentality in the militaristic field: I expand aggressively, using military primarily in a defensive role, then wipe out entire nations in a rush of Infantry or later game units).
Been thinking of solutions and three came to mind:
- Remove goody-hut upgrades for scouts
- Introduce an intermediate unit that can't be built, but only received via goody-huts (which will then upgrade to Explorer)
- Introduce an intermediate unit that can be built as usual
I'll try out each option before committing to one of them, opinions however are welcome ahead of time of course :)

Hey, I've really enjoyed all the options that this mod opens up. However, in the early-middle part of the game, I'm finding it unbalancing. Scouts that get the unit upgrade reward from ruins become explorers waaaay before explorers are available and (semi) balanced. The result is that a single explorer or experienced scout can dig in and practically siege a city on their own. Their huge resistance to ranged attacks and the fact that they live long enough to get Survival 3 means you can pillage an entire nation with these little buggers and no one can really stop you.

@mrktucson: I never confused the game with reality. In Reality there ARE mines in mountains...
I don't do it because I think it would be bad for the playing experience, taking away a strategic component. Without mountains, the playing field is flat. Mountains allow for funny tactics (ever watched 300? Imagine how that one would have turned out if armies could have moved as easily across mountains as across hills.) and can easily dictate strategy.
So yes, I like mountains, and I ain't gonna remove them or their strategic role.

well it worked great with all the civs, moutains are minned, used by military, used by religon, farmed by peru and indoesisa, and this is mods not the vanillia game. i guess i will do it myself since you think this is real history and reality

@mrktucson: Sry, but I won't make a mod like that. Mountains serve a specific role in terms of game balance and strategy and I'm not going to mess with it. However, if you really would like to enable building a railroad through it, JHoward has made a mode for that:
http://www.picknmixmods.com/mods/79a5acf9-2054-4632-b78f-03c9c4d56651/mod.html
(Please note: The mod requires another of his mod, the DLL mod).
Whatever you see on that page though ... don't ask me to do the same. James is several magnitudes of skill above m.

you want to make a mountian tile Mod... 3 production, movement...and road and railroad and forts allow to be built on them ?

I'm running BNW. Honestly I have lots of other mods but they were all getting along well until I loaded the update of Scout. I haven't checked previous saves but I will let you know. I don't have the mod helper but I'll look into that too.