White flags is causing the issue we removed white flags and it started working again.

Does this work in multiplayer because me and my friend are having troubles it keeps saying incorrect map. We are using no pollution mod and we have white flags at the top of everything.

Make sure that you drag and drop White Flags above it in the load order, otherwise it won’t work.

ReRolled Ultra doesnt seem to work?

finnaly when i remove a regoin they will give up

That WOULD be ideal, but it's also outside of my capabilities. I've floated the idea to the developer and he showed a bit of interest, so who knows?

would it be an idea to make the treshold a slider?

I first wish to thank you for making this mod, I was able to adjust. I play STEAM offline so games cannot update nor can mods.

Updated and lowered the threshold to 85% to make it more achievable.

I figured out how to mod the files such that I get a surrender at 50%.

I also made the bio/chem weapons more powerful.

So now everyone is happy

I can get a win with only 20% pollution so I just let it run at max speed and watch my other PC monitor.

So it's cool.

Thanks for the chems :)

The short version is, nuclear warfare follows MAD doctrine, and MAD doctrine means that neither side stops fighting until either everyone is dead or they no longer possess a means by which to attack. That's why the surrender threshold is currently at 95%. At 95%, the enemy doesn't surrender as much as completely collapse.

And for the record, it's not just you and me. In the ~4 days that this mod has been out, it's already close to reaching 100 players. Most of the feedback and suggestions I get for my mods comes from the official ICBM Discord, not here. I'm not going to make an entirely separate mod or change this one to cater to exactly one person.

In the context of unrestricted total nuclear war, the only way you could truly defeat a nuclear-armed enemy (especially one on equal footing, like in ICBM) is by completely and absolutely destroying their ability to retaliate, because if you don't, they'll simply retaliate regardless of casualties and the war won't end. In the age of mutually assured destruction, this is not feasible. The only way to force them to surrender is to utterly oblitherate them into such a state that they are completely incapable of fighting back, which more or less equates to completely destroying their entire civilian population.

ICBM is, at its core, a nuclear war sim. The bio/chemical weapons in Omnicide are designed to simply complement nuclear weapons rather than replace them entirely. The entire theme behind this game is thermonuclear annihilation, and what you are asking for really isn't in line with the spirit or mechanics of the game or any of the mods I've created for it. The biggest mod I've made is called OMNICIDE, which is pretty on the nose, no?

Now, for a nuclear war scenario and in the context of the game, a 50% casualty rate is basically nothing. You can accomplish that on the default map by destroying 4 cities. In a conventional war, that would be more than enough to force a surrender, but nuclear weapons completely change the dynamics of warfare, and the very expectation of a major nuclear war is that it would kill EVERYBODY.

It works via just chemical weapons took almost 2hours (sped up game time) to get to 5%, but that did end the game with "enemy surrendered".

I thank you for this, and beg for 50% Pop killed victory as well :)

The game "PLAGUE" allows for total world destruction via germs/bact/ect but (if they wanted to) they could just as easily make a situation where the bio agent did not spread far past the intended target.

Also, I wanted to use your bioweapons and chem weapons this would NOT cause world destruction anywhere near Nukes.

Even if it was a selectable that not everyone wanted to use, inflicting 95% death to an enemy (before) they surrender seems off.

The game wants you "not" use these weapons (it's pretty obvious from the end of game message), you were my only hope of playing a game and having a win and not "your world is in ruins".......how is that even a fun ending to a game........I purchased?

Why not just kill them all?

Would that still trigger a surrender?

It's just u and me pal :) this game is not for many and I doubt after this much time you will see a dozen (non-me) chats in here.

If this was reality, a country that lost 50% of it's "CIVILIANS", would be like when they did castle sieges the people would force the powers to surrender.

I mean, you can, it'll just be difficult. You can't win a full-on nuclear war without inflicting some massive casualties, and there's debate on if a nuclear war is even a winnable scenario in real life. I'll consider lowering the bar for surrendering based on player feedback.

So, if I wanted to win by just bombing with plague or chems, you cannot make a victory condition?

Ah that is sad news.

Back to Defcon I guess it my only choice then.

Thanks for responding.

If you want to win without genocide, you can accomplish that by capturing ~95% of the enemy's territory with armies via modding. I would say that seems quite reasonable. Or, you can always combine the two and capture most of their cities, and then destroy any others that are too difficult to invade. Remember, if you capture a territory, the entire population of that territory counts towards the enemy being defeated unless they take it back. The key here is that one way or another, the enemy has control over less than 5% of the population they started with. Whether they're dead or captured doesn't matter.

Since we both know that 93% of the dead u need to kill are civilians as it stands now.

If the goal is "winning" without genicide should not the number dead be closer to 50%?

In truth killing 40% of any pop would make a "should we give up?" scenario happen.

:) I was joking about 50% so that you might think killing 95% of the pop to force surrender needed adjustment :)

Even in North Korea, only 5% of the population is active duty. In the US, it’s only 0.4%. The whole purpose of countervalue strategies (i.e. attacking population centers with nuclear weapons) is that it deliberately destroys the population of the enemy itself, not its capacity to retaliate. It’s not done for any military purpose other than to try and force the enemy into submission by flat-out annihilating their civilians. It’s in the same line of thought as the firebombings and nuclear attacks on cities in WWII; the goal was not to capture the city in question as much as it was to destroy it as much as possible in order to cripple the enemy and put pressure on then to surrender. MAD doctrine is not about capturing anything, it’s about total annihilation.

Would anyone want to "conquer" a territory only after killing 95% of the pop?

On average I would suspect only 50% of the population is in the military.

That being said, I can look into tweaking the surrender threshold if people think it's too unattainable. I still want to keep it relatively hard to reach though.

In reality, nuclear silos and submarines can follow fail-deadly doctrine and attack even if the entire civilian population is dead and the government is wiped out. Given that total nuclear war is the highest possible level of escalation, and there's a genuine expectation that it'll wipe out the entire human race or effectively collapse most of civilization, I think it's reasonable that the point of surrender is the point at which it's completely futile to attempt to fight back.

Besides, where the game is concerned, 50% of the population is barely even the first strike. Any sapient country wouldn't resort to nuclear weapons unless they have nuclear blackmail on their side or there's absolutely no other hope of surviving. 95% is hard to achieve, but I think it's reasonable. In my opinion, anything less would make it too easy. After all, we're talking about defeating entire continent-sized factions.

This mod forces factions to surrender when more than 95% of their starting population is either dead and gone or in enemy hands.

In reality, wouldn't any sapient populated country surrender when it got to 50% dead?

Ah 95% is a bit hard to hit with the weak killing bioweapons, could bioweapons be made stronger?