Religion: Welsh
Request Type: Remove
Request: Remove the Welsh Religion
Rationale: There was never a religion post-Celtic migration and pre-English Conquest native to Wales beyond Brythonic Druidism and Insular Christianity so it makes no sense to exist.

引用自 KingMyrddin：

Religion: Welsh
Request Type: Remove
Request: Remove the Welsh Religion
Rationale: There was never a religion post-Celtic migration and pre-English Conquest native to Wales beyond Brythonic Druidism and Insular Christianity so it makes no sense to exist.

Yup, my quick research backs you up and the Welsh religion will be removed. The addition of this religion appears to be more of an anachronism. I will look at the things slated to be removed and where appropriate integrate those things into the Brythonic religion or save for a possible future culture.

Religion Name: Zalmoxism
Request Type: Add
Request:Add the Zalmoxist Religion
Rationale:Zalmoxism is the (in my opinion) highly underappreciated religion of the dacians, ancestors of the Romanians. It only really even began dying around the 3rd Century, when we find the first known conversions to christianity within the Dacian region, so it's not that far gone, and it's also pretty interesting being a henotheistic/monotheistic religion that was in many ways very similar to christianity (to the point supposedly anti-christians called early christians zalmoxist copycats)

引用自 Ms.Markarth：

引用自 KingMyrddin：

Religion: Welsh
Request Type: Remove
Request: Remove the Welsh Religion
Rationale: There was never a religion post-Celtic migration and pre-English Conquest native to Wales beyond Brythonic Druidism and Insular Christianity so it makes no sense to exist.

Yup, my quick research backs you up and the Welsh religion will be removed. The addition of this religion appears to be more of an anachronism. I will look at the things slated to be removed and where appropriate integrate those things into the Brythonic religion or save for a possible future culture.

I do not think that's fair. Yes, Maybe its more "historically correct" to remove but we Welsh have our myths and legends that are unique to our culture that the other parts of Britain do not have. There may not have been evidence left behind like Ireland had (and even that was heavily biblicised) but our oral tradition of legends and stories of old kings, witches and fairies have remained strong. I do believe that the Welsh religion is flawed, but to remove it is harsh.

Religion Name: Egyptian Faiths, specifically Cult of Aten
Request Type: Update
Request: Override the vanilla tenet "Sun Worship" so that it is accessible to Egyptian faiths upon reformation or branching. Furthermore Cult of Aten should have a low cost for this.
Rationale: Cult of Aten worships the sun disc god (possibly as a monotheistic deity) while Ra is an important figure in ancient Egypt.

Religion name: Hellenic faiths
Request Type: Update/Add
Request: Make vanilla Hellenic as the general starting point for a Roman Hellenism faith and a Greek Hellenism faith; leaving the standard one alone but as a family or such (like how Catholicism and Orthodox are related). Roman can be martial and have Warmonger with holy sites only in Italy, while Greek could be Mendicant Preacher or Communal Identity, with holy sites in Greece, Thrace, and Crete.
Rationale: Having Greek and Roman Hellenism be separate options alongside the game's Greco-Roman one will fit how Italy and Greece were *both* major nations (Roman Republic and the Greek cities followed by Macedon) and had widespread influence before they fused under the Roman Empire, which will allow people to go either way rather than always rebuild the full version of the Roman Empire. Roman Hellenics should keep their ability to form Rome as the Hellenic faith can, while Greek Hellenics maybe could create a Greater Greek Empire or restore Alexander's empire by conquering as far as Afghanistan (or perhaps even further); go their own way rather than emulate the Italians' feats, as it were.

Religion Name: Greco-Roman
Request Type: Update
Request: change the color and icon of either Dodekatheism or Religio Romana
Rationale: Right now, they're the same color and icon, which might be a tad confusing. Maybe Religio Romana could just have a red parthenon instead of blue, and change Dodekatheism's color to be closer to its icon.

引用自 Pippintastic：

引用自 Ms.Markarth：

Yup, my quick research backs you up and the Welsh religion will be removed. The addition of this religion appears to be more of an anachronism. I will look at the things slated to be removed and where appropriate integrate those things into the Brythonic religion or save for a possible future culture.

I do not think that's fair. Yes, Maybe its more "historically correct" to remove but we Welsh have our myths and legends that are unique to our culture that the other parts of Britain do not have. There may not have been evidence left behind like Ireland had (and even that was heavily biblicised) but our oral tradition of legends and stories of old kings, witches and fairies have remained strong. I do believe that the Welsh religion is flawed, but to remove it is harsh.

Arthur is not a religious figure, he's closer to a folk hero, especially as he is resoundedly Christian in his tales. Also many figures can also be seen in other stories, for example the boy Ceridwen ate and was reincarnated into Taliesin is related to Finn MacCool in Ireland as is Pryderi to another character I believe. Not to mention that the Cornish and Bretons also have Arthur, he categorically is not solely Welsh and it's Wales having a distinct religion that I have umbrage with, not the Brythonic one which would cover the Bretons and Cornish.

引用自 KingMyrddin：

引用自 Pippintastic：

I do not think that's fair. Yes, Maybe its more "historically correct" to remove but we Welsh have our myths and legends that are unique to our culture that the other parts of Britain do not have. There may not have been evidence left behind like Ireland had (and even that was heavily biblicised) but our oral tradition of legends and stories of old kings, witches and fairies have remained strong. I do believe that the Welsh religion is flawed, but to remove it is harsh.

Arthur is not a religious figure, he's closer to a folk hero, especially as he is resoundedly Christian in his tales. Also many figures can also be seen in other stories, for example the boy Ceridwen ate and was reincarnated into Taliesin is related to Finn MacCool in Ireland as is Pryderi to another character I believe. Not to mention that the Cornish and Bretons also have Arthur, he categorically is not solely Welsh and it's Wales having a distinct religion that I have umbrage with, not the Brythonic one which would cover the Bretons and Cornish.

I wasn't referring to King Arthur specifically. Never have I considered him more than a literary figure that may have been very loosely based on an actual king, which is still debatable. What isn't up for debate is that even the game considers him important, maybe not religiously but definitely culturally (just look to the reclaim Britannia decision). Also, the issue with Brythonic myths and legends being Christian is universal.
Also, the argument of syncratisim in the Brythonic cultures meaning that the Welsh aren't allowed to have their own religious culture and important sites is a bit daft no offence. Its like saying that because the Romans believed in syncratisim in their culture (for example Sulis Minerva of the Springs at Bath being a syncratic goddess) their religion wasn't a real religion.

引用自 Pippintastic：

引用自 KingMyrddin：

Arthur is not a religious figure, he's closer to a folk hero, especially as he is resoundedly Christian in his tales. Also many figures can also be seen in other stories, for example the boy Ceridwen ate and was reincarnated into Taliesin is related to Finn MacCool in Ireland as is Pryderi to another character I believe. Not to mention that the Cornish and Bretons also have Arthur, he categorically is not solely Welsh and it's Wales having a distinct religion that I have umbrage with, not the Brythonic one which would cover the Bretons and Cornish.

I wasn't referring to King Arthur specifically. Never have I considered him more than a literary figure that may have been very loosely based on an actual king, which is still debatable. What isn't up for debate is that even the game considers him important, maybe not religiously but definitely culturally (just look to the reclaim Britannia decision). Also, the issue with Brythonic myths and legends being Christian is universal.
Also, the argument of syncratisim in the Brythonic cultures meaning that the Welsh aren't allowed to have their own religious culture and important sites is a bit daft no offence. Its like saying that because the Romans believed in syncratisim in their culture (for example Sulis Minerva of the Springs at Bath being a syncratic goddess) their religion wasn't a real religion.

Okay but you're not advocating for a religion at all but seemingly more cultural decisions, which I'm for. A religion though is a big no.

The Welsh have never had a religion unique to them, by the time that the Old Welsh language had diverged from Common Brittonic era in the Early Anglo-Saxon Period the Britons had been Christians for a couple of centuries and even before that the gods they worshipped were likely the same as the other Britons and likely very similar to other Celtic peoples such as the Gaels.

So yes recommend them to add more cultural decisions based on folktales and cultural stories that have roots in the earlier mythology like those found in the Mabinogi but don't try and make them into a religion which is what this thread is about because it categorically was not. If it was anything close to it Gildas certainly would have been screeching it down our earholes after all.

引用自 KingMyrddin：

引用自 Pippintastic：

I wasn't referring to King Arthur specifically. Never have I considered him more than a literary figure that may have been very loosely based on an actual king, which is still debatable. What isn't up for debate is that even the game considers him important, maybe not religiously but definitely culturally (just look to the reclaim Britannia decision). Also, the issue with Brythonic myths and legends being Christian is universal.
Also, the argument of syncratisim in the Brythonic cultures meaning that the Welsh aren't allowed to have their own religious culture and important sites is a bit daft no offence. Its like saying that because the Romans believed in syncratisim in their culture (for example Sulis Minerva of the Springs at Bath being a syncratic goddess) their religion wasn't a real religion.

Okay but you're not advocating for a religion at all but seemingly more cultural decisions, which I'm for. A religion though is a big no.

The Welsh have never had a religion unique to them, by the time that the Old Welsh language had diverged from Common Brittonic era in the Early Anglo-Saxon Period the Britons had been Christians for a couple of centuries and even before that the gods they worshipped were likely the same as the other Britons and likely very similar to other Celtic peoples such as the Gaels.

So yes recommend them to add more cultural decisions based on folktales and cultural stories that have roots in the earlier mythology like those found in the Mabinogi but don't try and make them into a religion which is what this thread is about because it categorically was not. If it was anything close to it Gildas certainly would have been screeching it down our earholes after all.

Fair enough. Sorry for the argument, I just felt the request for the removal of Welsh was unfair, and it felt like Wales was getting the shaft (again). With the removal of the Welsh religion (which frankly I was going to suggest a name change anyway as it sounds a bit daft) there would be no Brythonic religious presence in Wales in the game, none of the religions under the branch would have a holy site in Wales.
Even if its not accurate and the welsh myths and legends are more culturally significant that religiously, I appreciate the original mod (and this one) for giving the Welsh their own religious identity since if you wanted to play with the religions you'd have to conquer a lot of area to truly benefit from.

引用自 Pippintastic：

引用自 KingMyrddin：

Okay but you're not advocating for a religion at all but seemingly more cultural decisions, which I'm for. A religion though is a big no.

The Welsh have never had a religion unique to them, by the time that the Old Welsh language had diverged from Common Brittonic era in the Early Anglo-Saxon Period the Britons had been Christians for a couple of centuries and even before that the gods they worshipped were likely the same as the other Britons and likely very similar to other Celtic peoples such as the Gaels.

So yes recommend them to add more cultural decisions based on folktales and cultural stories that have roots in the earlier mythology like those found in the Mabinogi but don't try and make them into a religion which is what this thread is about because it categorically was not. If it was anything close to it Gildas certainly would have been screeching it down our earholes after all.

Fair enough. Sorry for the argument, I just felt the request for the removal of Welsh was unfair, and it felt like Wales was getting the shaft (again). With the removal of the Welsh religion (which frankly I was going to suggest a name change anyway as it sounds a bit daft) there would be no Brythonic religious presence in Wales in the game, none of the religions under the branch would have a holy site in Wales.
Even if its not accurate and the welsh myths and legends are more culturally significant that religiously, I appreciate the original mod (and this one) for giving the Welsh their own religious identity since if you wanted to play with the religions you'd have to conquer a lot of area to truly benefit from.

Fair enough but I hope at the very least from my username and the fact that I actually know who Pwyll is that I've shown that I love Welsh mythology.
I've not looked at Brythonic yet but it astounds me if it doesn't have a holy site in Wales, at the very least I'd expect one in Ynys Mon which was a stronghold of the Druids according to the fact that that's the very reason why there wasn't a legion prepared to stop Boudica's initial rebellion.
Honestly I hate it when any part of the UK gets the shaft...except for maybe London...

Religion Name: Brythonic
Request Type: Update
Request: Change the locations of the holy sites and potential name change of Religion.
Rationale: With the eventual removal of the Welsh religion, I believe that there should be a rearrangement of the Brythonic religion's holy sites to include a site in Wales.
Though its still sort of debated in academic circles, many see Ynys Mon (Anglesey) as the final frontier for the Druids in Britain, as such I (and @KingMyrddin I'd assume) believe that it should be considered a holy site. Without it, Wales and the Welsh culture would not have any holy sites located in the dejure kingdom, thus making it more difficult if players wish to try playing as the welsh with this mod.
Furthermore, I believe a name change for all the Celtic religions should be considered. Currently, the names are very on the nose. Though we don't know what the people might have called their religion, I believe there are better options. Perhaps using the term Druidism, or even using the Celtic languages for inspiration on names and titles.

引用自 Pippintastic：

Religion Name: Brythonic
Request Type: Update
Request: Change the locations of the holy sites and potential name change of Religion.
Rationale: With the eventual removal of the Welsh religion, I believe that there should be a rearrangement of the Brythonic religion's holy sites to include a site in Wales.
Though its still sort of debated in academic circles, many see Ynys Mon (Anglesey) as the final frontier for the Druids in Britain, as such I (and @KingMyrddin I'd assume) believe that it should be considered a holy site. Without it, Wales and the Welsh culture would not have any holy sites located in the dejure kingdom, thus making it more difficult if players wish to try playing as the welsh with this mod.
Furthermore, I believe a name change for all the Celtic religions should be considered. Currently, the names are very on the nose. Though we don't know what the people might have called their religion, I believe there are better options. Perhaps using the term Druidism, or even using the Celtic languages for inspiration on names and titles.

Sorry I've been absent for this discussion, both of you are so much more well versed in this stuff than I am and I was at a loss for how to proceed.

I think fixing Brythonic is a great idea. It seems reasonable that Brythonic was missing Welsh sites when there was a Welsh religion and the only right thing to do is to balance Brythonic to be the religion that also covers Wales.

Also, I love the idea of fixing up the names, even if the only benefit is to clear up some noun confusion. (That guy is gaelic but is he religiously gaelic or culturally gaelic? lol) Uh, I haven't the first clue where to start looking though. I've got some free time today and will probably start looking at what I can do.

Thank you both so much I can't tell you how much I need the help :D

Religion Name: Zunism
Request Type: Update
Request: A decision to revive Zunism.
Rationale: Zunism, at the earliest game start, had only been dead for about 100-200 years (the dates are unknown), and the biggest source comes from Xuanzang, 7th century Buddhist Monk. A nice summary of that was written by Gulman sher Afridi, named "Etymology of Zhunbil and Identity of the Rulers of Kabul and Zabul in Seventh -Ninth Centuries C.E", if you want to read further.