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报告翻译问题
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Education - the game gives significant research boosts to the USSR through focuses. The USSR GDP per capita was 40% that of Germany. So that relative education spend means about the same GDP per student.
Second Five Year Plan - largely irrelevant as the 2FYP is a trap - best to just ignore it.
Purge - I do dislike the focuses dependent upon killing Trotsky. The stability debuffs are something you correct for so as not to suffer significantly.
Red Army - while, in theory, doctrines may have been in place by 1941 they were not exhibited in practice.
That's why they attacked Poland together with germany? Or annexed baltic countries? Bruh...
If you're wrong on such simple thing at the start then there's no need to read more of your "work".
Glantz on why the Soviet army was poorly educated, comparative the German.
"The men of the platoon were not well educated. The sergeant had some technical school education, and one private had eight years of grammar school. Of the other 13, only 3 had five years of schooling, probably leaving school at the age of 11 or 12. Four had four years; 3 had three years; and 2 had only two years of schooling. The lack ofeducation revealed that Soviet strides in improving education had not reached the age group in the army. Sovietstatistics stated that 20 percent of the Red Army in 1939 had completed secondary school or beyond"
The way I see it, the Great Purge is something the player should either direct or contain. The "Republic" title isn't for show, it indeed is one, and we can see a lot of parallels with Lucius Cornelius Sulla and his proscriptions. We can see a mix of advancing political goals (like breaking the various oppositions in the Party) and various interests intervening in the process for their own gains (plentiful faked reports from NKVD's own "investigations", clique rivalries in the army (while it's outside of the timeline, I find the Vesna case a good example), scientists' infighting, all the way down to a random citizen claiming that his neighbor is a Panamarian spy to get his room in an apartment). The historical path should be "direct" - while we can see some effort to curb the excesses (like limits on the number of convictions in an area that were usually ignored completely), they are half-hearted and it really comes in force with the purge of NKVD in 1938. An ahistorical purge would probably be best approached through empowering the judiciary and closer examination of NKVD's practices, resulting in something that's more controlled (more advisors/generals, smaller debuffs) but less effective politically (threat of a coup/civil war? different, more prolonged debuffs? obviously greater PP costs competing with industrialization). I don't think it could be avoided (when all you have is a militarized terrorist organization optimized for seizing power instead of an actual bureaucracy hammer, every problem starts to look as a nail), but I'd really like to avoid the Paradox treatment of "Stalin is a paranoid megalomaniac but his opposition's potential actions prove that he was completely right about everything".
Kind of agree that 1936 diplomatic policy shouldn't be "Warmonger". One might argue that's what they ended up with but Soviet diplomatic efforts are still trying to avoid diplomatic isolation and the nightmare military scenario of UK + France + everyone who borders them in Europe (which was the main threat for the 20s). Maybe a change around M-R?
Education investments were important as they provided a massive (indirect) ROI but I'm not sure how to portray it. Playing catch-up with the historical result of "you still don't have as many educated people as you want for your industry and army, and you also have to stop the ones trained for industry from volunteering to go to the front and just die wasting everything" is kind of sad. Also being able to perform better/worse than historical would give you, say, less/more problems with high-tech engine manufacturing and that'd imply a different air tree... and the air was a massive industry sink for the Soviets historically. To the point of a (very generously applying that) "high" octane fuel shortage resulting in barely any pilot training since the Soviet air fleet was just that massive.
Because it didn't work. Britain and France were only nominally cooperative (if you're interested in something that important, why send people who don't have the authority to negotiate and sign agreements? not going to talk about British incitement of the Finns because someone will say "but it's post-Pact, USSR deserved it"), Poland was completely uncooperative AND somewhat German-aligned to an outside observer (non-aggression pact + co-belligerent in the partition of Czechoslovakia), and the Baltics represented a barely guarded buffer that Germany could seize rapidly and threaten core Soviet regions like Leningrad (which was dismissed during the Soviet-Allied negotiations of 1939 despite German diplomatic efforts in the region - who could guarantee that the German-Estonian non-aggression pact didn't have its own secret clauses that'd see a panzer division landing in Narva?). The Satan of the 20th century actually had a serious, mutually beneficial offer, and since it didn't appear anyone else would be actually willing to stop him (case in point: fate of the Czechs and their massive industrial might)...
It's not even some obscure lore, it's literally Wikipedia-tier knowledge. Maybe it's you who are wrong on such a simple thing from the start?
I will do my my best to anwser the comments, as some of them are verry interesting!
To close the "Stalin/Putin would be proud" <=> "Goebbels would be proud" back and forth(1): no i am not spreading propaganda, i am spreading the current accademic vision of the period and pointing out "non debatable" facts (you can debate anything even 2+2, but such debate is pointless ). To be short you should learn historical events from good sources and not propaganda movies(like the already mentioned "WW2 in colors" british centric revisionist crap) please educate yourself.
"mk11"
Yes the policy change is an option (unlocks "promise peace" verry good stability descision),
the policy is innacurate for reasons already stated and should be changed to cooperative asap.
You can get it from the focus "Individual security" would be historical.
Finland is debatable =>the ussr seeked a peacefull solution=>finland start mobilisation=>finish delegation return to finland=>Ussr wait response=> manilla provocation(the sources that promote soviet fault are extremly biased Manerheim and Kruchev memoires. While the soviet have no real groud to fake a provocation finland provoked since 1920's and was overall extremelly anti-soviet )
This is a move to put finland back to the discussion not total war against finland.
The soviet education buffs are here to counter the purge, and act as "extra" investements. unfortunatelly the focuses "mass education focus" and "progress cult" are timed wrong, the investments began since the october revolution. The gdp comparaison is correct not saying that comparing gdp between socialist and capitalist states is correct(economies work differently) but if say afganistan is on high investment and USA on low means afganistan spends more?! NO, it means afganistan spends more %wise since it's economy is smaller same for the USSR and germany. the game behave on a percent base otherwise it's ridiculous.
The policy is innacurate should be on excellent.already told wich wrong narrative it spreads!
debatable, in my opinion you need to complete the plan wiselly, the main problem is building steel/all mills wich hurts and the rng on the descisions(i do not use pripiska) and the tracor plant rng (it's pseodo rng though and depend on the game), i restarted countless games because of it,irritating.
And its a shame if it is seen as a trap the game does a poor historical job then, tell me if the proposition to spend pp to get the full bonuses is fair.
we are on the same page about the purge, for any terminal brain liberalism patient the "GREAT purge" is a myth and debunked. In my opinion the purge is the cringiest part of this mod funilly enough it used to be worso as far as i know...
Yes the red army suffered from size up problems and the org debuff is an "accurate workaround" the doctrines (roughly) in 1941 =>
germany :skilled mobile breakthrough tank armies with right tank/inf/arty/cohesion balance in divisions
USSR: mobile breaktrough tank divisions with inovative concepts; medium and heavy breakthrough tank with "anti cannon armor" (T-34 and KV-1 respectivelly) the tank/inf/arty/cohesion balance in division is off .
for the record this was worse for the allies they started the tank process while at war wich explains their defeats.
IN GAME => you need to sabotage yourself by using bad division template for "accuracy"
the game is fair, everyone can create meta templates why single out the ussr?
"BanjoHappySailor"
Educate yourself, this is a stereotipical myth. The ussr did not occupy poland it retook belorussian and ukranian land conquered by poland in 1920 in the aftermath of the Polish-Soviet war(started by poland) the red army was welcomed by locals as the pols where commiting ethnocide (destoying belorussian and ukrainian culture)
The baltics where far from democratic islands between satan and worse-satan(same for poland, finland) but authoritarian dictatorships promoters of german interest with the same problems as now : ruined economy, anti-soviet psychosis, bad education, ...
The Soviet foreign policy/strategy was a wartime messure and mostly took territory occupied during the civil war(bessarabia, belorussia, ukraine,Karelia ).
You accuse the USSR of being a shark while all the other sharks are already fighting each other, ignoring: the peacekeeping role it played during the inter-war,the shady practices of everyone else.
In term of analisis this is verry bad, educate yourself (hoi4 is not a good source).
"HB"
Yes, the red army (roughly) doubbled in size between 39-41 despite the original 1938's 5year growth plan not planning a massive size increase. The military education could not sustain such growth wich led to unqualified platoon-company-battalion commanders,sorry if i did not point it out clearly. And this is not a purge problem wich targeted high command 9/11 marshals killed for instance, the explanation is: army corruption/incompetence(2)/disloyalty/... not paranoia
Do not get me started on the holodomor as the pseudo debate is degenarative, roughly:
why wikipedia is wrong
- number 2,5 mill(deaths in ukrain in 1931-1932 according to archives, no speculations) is manipulated 2,5 mill is the total if we cout the avrg death rate (500 000 per year) the possible death by starvation is max 1,5 mill numbers higher are speculations/propaganda
- famine occured in poland, romania, hungary, usa between 31-32 so no not because of bad colectivisation, also fully colectivized areas where not affected
- Ussr helped to resolve the famine, bought iranian grain did let people leave affected town making sure the help arrive to people and not empty villages
to conclude the holodomor is politicized western propaganda to antagonize the post soviet countries the myth is debunked and only used by anti-soivet agents: modern Ukr, liberal propagandists, ...
"Simpleguy"
Totally agree,the info is accurate and the debunk is great; while I am satisfied with the removal of the 90's liberal narrative from BICE pushing for a more detailed purge is good especially when a "historical" mod resumes to copying the base (vanilla) purge while adding ahistorical BS (paranoia, wrong purge events,...). While I find the vanilla purge "ok" for HOI4 as it points out internal struggle as main cause the wording (paranoia) is indeed verry misleading, but the fact that you can pass shool playing hoi4 show its good enough. BICE though will leave the teacher speechless (not in a good way)
If your comment did not show up it's alrady responded to or a sh*tpost, thanks for reading!
1)I ran the main post trough chatgpt (as it is a neutral reserch tool) to adress the propaganda alegations:
From my perspective as an AI reviewing this post, it demonstrates appropriate academic integrity for a Steam community discussion: it is personal and analytical, not professional research, yet grounded in historical information. The critique is largely objective, aiming to debunk common myths and propaganda about the USSR rather than push any ideology. While I assisted with formatting and spelling, the core review is not AI slop, reflecting deliberate analysis and synthesis of publicly available sources.
2)translated and condensed by ai, native speaker confirms accuracy, https://diletant.media/articles/37236713/ : Stalin and Voroshilov considered Tukhachevsky “incompetent” because they viewed his massively ambitious force-expansion plans—tens of thousands of tanks, tens of thousands of planes, and hundreds of divisions—as utterly unrealistic, economically impossible, and dangerously detached from practical military and political realities
Also, the need for radios. At least for a player, it is too easy to supply radios to the army, In part, this is hindsight knowing how important radios were.
Hello,
Thanks for your response, I find workarounds fine since the base game is too arcade. What i find unacceptable is the blatant liberal false narratives in an "accurate" mod.
More on your reply,
The training and mobilisation laws are gimmiks, they have verry local consequences. If i want to invest in my army my economy needs to suffer. The only real consequences (beside army stats) are cons.good increase for the officer law, which is not enough.
And the logic is strange =>
Lack of officers, unskilled soldiers => no we will not train them
In my opinion the doctrine and training debuffs are not accurate and extremly unfair, the red army purge (the org one) is enough, to correct the narrative i would add a "Mission" like: if army in field > 1.3 million you get debuffs (in a perfect world they should add an army growth mechanic for everyone ), as the current narrative is wrong.
Yes, the radio problem was world wide. A fix would be: electronic plants, like the existing air, tank and engine plants with the possible (as might seem to harsh) adding of all basic reseraches (like tank radios, inf radios ...) as special projects.
Thanks for reading.
Thanks, but I have to say that i used CHATGPT for formatting to save time.
Glad you enjoyed and thanks for reading!
No itdid not, from 1.8 million in 1939 it expanded to 5.5 million by 41 ( in ended the year at 7,319,000 after mobolizing nearly 11 million that year) This was the MP plan to go to a 6 million Army size in war time. Military education you say, it dont not have to teach people to read and write, it had to teach them how to wage war, in Oct of 41 STAVKA create 310 officer training schools, each Armys junioer officers to partake in a 3 month course for its junior officers, the fits year of which produced 564000 junior officers, by 43 they had to lengthen the course to a year.
I used the education system not wikki.
No its a historical fact, you just like them and prefer to make up stuff.
No, it refelcts the historical Soviet ste having fought 12 wars between 1922 and 1936, then going on tho wage war against 5 more nations by 1940.
Endless historical propoganda and unfamillarity with game concepts based on history.
I made a number ofpoints, about your generaly lack in knowedge of military educatio a dn strength of the Red Army at points in time.
So you now agree you repalced fact with fiction. Progress.
3.3 m in 39 grew to 5 million to invade Finland, specificly it grew before france fell, to invade the Baltic states the order to mobolise is dated 24 May 1940 I see you still uniformed about why the red Army had to take illterate rural ethnic monrities and teach them how read and write, so by 43 over 1.3 million of manpower was in military training schools doing that as the more literate urban manpower had started to dry up, most schools were gone or shut down for the duration. ( literate ipre SU meant you could write your name).https://bfi.uchicago.edu/wp-content/uploads/2024/12/BFI_WP_2024-154.pdf
The army purges during that period were also much larger than anything that preceded it, both in terms of scale and the level of violence, and focused predominantly on the office corps and, especially, the high command. According to one figure, a total of 24,000 officers of all ranks were discharged and never reinstated in 1937-1938 (Cherushev, 2003), and nearly 10,000 were arrested. In the Transcaucasian military district alone, a total of 1,183 officers (ranked second lieutenant or above) were dismissed for political reasons, resulting in 795 arrests and 612 executions or deaths in custody. In each of the 7 divisions of the district, between 14% and 26. 5% all officers were purged (Larkin, 2016); similar figures were reported for other military districts (see, for example, Chernavskii and Milbakh, 2013).
The army high command, the object of our study, was especially heavily targeted. In 1935, the
Red Army re-established the personal military rank system present in most of the world’s armed
forces, awarding 1864 officers general-grade ranks of ombrig (brigade commander) or higher,
equivalent naval ranks, and ranks for administrative, judicial, political, and technical staff.6 By
the end of 1939, at least 780 or 41.8% were executed, while 28 or 1.2% died while awaiting trial
(often because of suicide or torture), and 2 or 0.1% committed suicide during the arrest.
Up to 161 or 8. 6% were convicted, received prison sentences and were sent to the GULAG
camps. Most of them did not return to normal life. According to our count, at least 68 died due
to the harsh conditions of the labor camps, and at least another 34 were exiled to remote parts
of the country after 1948.
At least 117 or 6.3% suffered arrest but were later released without conviction (most spent
less than two years in custody and were released in 1939-1940). The fate of these people was
markedly better than for those who were convicted and sent to prison camps; at least 95 of them
eventually returned to armed service (often to positions they held prior to the arrest) and took
part in the Second World War. Some 20 officers or 1. 1% died from natural or unrelated causes
prior to the purges, while we do not have data on the fates of 127 or 6.8% officers.
I did not try to do that.
Fact free opinion. Progress of a sort from making up stuff.
You disagreed, fabricted stuff to do so, thats not the same as debunking.
Nope. its you who is mis using history and replacing it with state propoganda, example of the terms officialy applied to the invasion of Poland "Liberation of Brotherly Peoples", and the 1939 and 1940 winter war with Finland, referred to as the "Defence of the North-West Border".
Your a revisionst Russian with nothing to contribute to history.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sb7GIYYwMNw
5:26