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That isn't an issue. That is intended and balanced
Yes I heard that you can safely retreat while the SSD shields are still up i.e. no risk of losing the precious SSD then due to ion/stun.
HOWEVER, in late game which this is about the enemy huge fleet will most likely take down said SSD shields in a very very short time since there is no "huge support fleet" available for the SSD due to popcap limits, so the SSD wlll be their main focus except some fire on your point defense units in front of it.
Also said enemy fleet will likely have alot of interdictors some of which you probably cannot even reach e.g. hapan interdiction mines or mon mothma destroyers spawning far away.
So that strategy would be based on *hoping* that no interdictor is blocking you jumping out but even if so, how many jumps in/out would it mean to take down a huge fleet safely (for the SSD) if you jump while shields still up ? 20 ? That sounds like an awfully risky tactic considering interdictors.
So to me this "whittle" is a tactic that is not sound but very risky and also yes, "way more micro and time" with all those jumps and manually clicking hardpoints compared to using smaller ships instead.
But I appreciate the feedback immensely so thank you!!!
(As an example: In my current game I have a Hapan fleet with 3500 pop with 21 interdictors in it. Enemy huge NR fleets I previously fought had up to 76 (!) of those CC-7000 or wahtever they are called small interdictors in them).
I agree that SSDs are balanced fairly against other ships looking only at stats but please consider firstly this - they are not replacable as other ships are.
Another consideration is that as SSDs are infamous for not spreading their firepower aound, alot and perhaps even most, of their power is just wasted with 40 turbolasers all firing at one hardpoint when 1-2 would get the same job done. Yes you can circumvent that partially by doing alot of micro i.e. clicking, but only partially.
So. Considering the above one could argue that SSDs are infact not balanced I think. They can definitely not be used as intended (as far as I remember from reading SW books) i.e. with a large supporting fleet. They are definitely more of a joke than a terror when facing a fleet comprising of smaller frigates/cruisers/capital ships.
But really, what I am looking for is not rebalancing just a a purpose for these behemoths in late game or a tactic using them in large late-game huge fleet battles that is sound.
Them getting a different balance system is would make them unbalanced. They are limited to prevent steamrolling from players. Their less then ideal fire situation is something that cannot be prevented in EaW.
SSDs are deadly tools in player hands even in late game. Players just need to choose when they are a good option and when they aren't.
Some players do that, but it heavily drains performance and most SSDs can already be supported by a sizeable escort fleet.
Escort does not mean that you bring multiple ISDs with you, but that you bring smaller ships to protect it from small enemy crafts.
However, there really is no good way to destroy a 3,500 popcap fleet. You actually need to defeat it strategically, and the way to do that is to constantly destroy the enemy faction's space structures without taking the planets, while building up fleets along their borders. That way they lose production capability, and are forced to split up their giant fleet in order to cover the defenses against your fleets threatening them. Then you keep attacking those split off fleets to reduce their total numbers.
It's not a foolproof strategy or anything, there are several circumstances where it can go wrong. For example if you end up fighting two or more huge forces like this at once, there's almost no way you can have the needed fleets to spare. It's best when you direct your invasions to begin with to allow enemy factions to attack each other as much as possible - If you're the NR for example and rush all your bordering neutral planets, and hem in Maldrood and Hapes by taking Kashyyyk or Commenor or whatever, suddenly you'll get attacked by them like every week because your territory is so open to theirs. But overall you shouldn't be afraid to just give ground in order to advance a long-term advantage somewhere else, if you're forced into a situation where you can't 1v1 their main fleet, just avoid it and go wreck their other planets. Even on cruel the AI isn't as quick and aggressive as you can be.
It might be best if every SSD had a "Death Squadron"-like default attachment of three or so ISDs that didn't contribute to the popcap, so they could have a stronger defensive force altogether. Or at least for named heroes.
In fact, maybe that's not even accurate - Only for SSDs that actually commanded an oversector fleet. From those we know of, I *think* the only other named one aside from Death Squadron was Kaine's Scourge Squadron. But given similar positions, Zsinj's Brawl in the Mid-rim and I suppose one of several SSDs of the core would occupy a position within a similar squadron.
@Azihar I have thousands of hours in EAW since way back when I played with CDs and always play cruel from start in FOTR, AOTR, TR so winning is not a problem in fact all these mods are a bit too easy for my taste so I play with some house rules to make them harder but still steamroll the map like many other players here.
Speaking of AOTR, that is a mod where I like their SSDs as they fit with my imagination of them, they are a real terror to cruisers and larger, when you click enemy ships they are deleted almost instantly. They can also stand their own with some lancer/carrier support way way longer in battle than in TR so in that mod they are feasible to spawn in from start against huge fleets whereas in TR nope. You can also in AOTR rebuild a few more if you lose the SSD so losing one (happens but takes a long and epic fight to manage that with huge enemy losses) will not be a huge loss.
However in AOTR SSDs are more like a thing to spice up the end-game as you get them late (when you are unstoppble already in most cases).
In TR the same approach would be difficult to manage as you get the SSDs early/mid game already, before the AI builds up, and then they would be too OP even in their weak current state. At least for the vast majority of players without house rules.
So again, I find it sad that these impressive ships just have no vital role in mid- to end game of TR. Meeting an SSD in some other mods is a bit of a shock and needs some real strategy to deal with but in TR you just *yawn* and collect a random riff-raff fleet of say 300-400 popcap (for Hapes perhaps 250-300 popcap is more than enough) and the SSD is dead with minimal losses. AI will do same to you- yes even if they lack interdictors (which is unlikely mid to end game) there is a high probability that they will kill your unreplacable SSD when (not if) you are forced to retreat due to ion/stun. Which is why I rarely use my SSDs late game exept in the big bully scenario where the enemy fleet is small, the risk is simply too great otherwise.
That just doesn't work against 700, 800, or 1000 pop fleets. Instead SSDs become force multipliers late-game. Consider:
You have a 600 pop fleet, with an Executor-class SSD. You are attacking an 800 pop fleet with no SSD. If you jump in the Executor first, it will get bogged down in a fight of attrition it can't win. Instead you should jump in a 300-point fleet first, without the SSD - if you're smart and you know what you're doing, you'll have a better composition and formation than the AI (e.g. using long-range fighter swarms to secure "air superiority" as the PA before engaging, or using a solid, intelligently deployed backline of frigates backstopping your ISDs/Allegiances/Praetor as the Empire to maximise damage output). As the two fleets slug it out, you should come out slightly on top - let's say you're down 200ish pop cap and they've lost 300-400.
This is the moment you call in your SSD. The enemy fleet is battered, your fleet is battered, and into the middle of this you call in your massive flagship, once your respective vanguards have bloodied each other. At this point your SSD + escorts should be able to push through and clear out the enemy fleet, which will arrive piecemeal as the AI loses ships.
End result? Your SSD means your smaller fleet just wiped most, or all, of a much larger fleet. SSDs transition from being battering rams to force multipliers - you just need to adapt your tactics as the game goes on.