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bAd a!m 22. nov. kl. 19:06
are DOCTORS (medics) EVIL ??? - a religious debate
it's been pointed out in many other threads that there is at least ONE god, maybe more (so they say) and this god is of course mighty and all-knowing and all-powerful.

so this begs the question ... ARE DOCTORS EVIL FOR INTERFERING WITH GOD'S PLAN?

each day across the world, doctors perform miracles and save countless lives and also heal children and help deliver babies who would have been a stillborn if not for the modern medicine.

but what if this is against god's will?

what do you think?
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Marmarmar34 22. nov. kl. 19:11 
Anything and everything that happens is part of God's plan. To interfere with it would be interfering with the very concept of existence. At least in the Christian sense.
#1
Houseman 22. nov. kl. 19:13 
Assuming such a god with such a plan, it wouldn't even be possible to theoretically interfere with it, since the actions of everybody, including these doctors, would all be part of the plan.

Nobody would have free will. Everybody would be acting according to the plan. Therefore, nobody would be able to interfere with the plan.
#2
Marmarmar34 22. nov. kl. 19:16 
Oprindeligt skrevet af Houseman:
Assuming such a god with such a plan, it wouldn't even be possible to theoretically interfere with it, since the actions of everybody, including these doctors, would all be part of the plan.

Nobody would have free will. Everybody would be acting according to the plan. Therefore, nobody would be able to interfere with the plan.
That's only if you believe everything is preordained instead of left in a sea of chaos.

Personally, I believe we were formed with no actual plan outside of the very laws of our universe. The fact we are the part of the universe that can observe and (somewhat) comprehend it is a miracle in it of itself.
#3
Rumpelcrutchskin 22. nov. kl. 19:17 
How quaintly medieval thinking. I´m sure they were very happy with no doctors during their Black Death plagues that killed half of Europe.
#4
hehexd 22. nov. kl. 19:17 
Youre suggesting letting nature run its course would be more in line with god, what if humans resisting nature is in line with gods plan?
#5
Jololo 22. nov. kl. 19:17 
This was already answered in the middle ages go read the answer.
#6
Houseman 22. nov. kl. 19:19 
Oprindeligt skrevet af Marmarmar34:
That's only if you believe everything is preordained instead of left in a sea of chaos.

No, you're assuming that everything is preordained. That's implicit in "God's plan". That's what that means.

If "God's plan"
Then "everything is preordained"
#7
Marmarmar34 22. nov. kl. 19:20 
Oprindeligt skrevet af hehexd:
Youre suggesting letting nature run its course would be more in line with god, what if humans resisting nature is in line with gods plan?
Humans are literally of nature though? People dividing us from nature only do that because we currently have the means to reshape what nature even means.
Sidst redigeret af Marmarmar34; 22. nov. kl. 19:20
#8
Marmarmar34 22. nov. kl. 19:22 
Oprindeligt skrevet af Houseman:
Oprindeligt skrevet af Marmarmar34:
That's only if you believe everything is preordained instead of left in a sea of chaos.

No, you're assuming that everything is preordained. That's implicit in "God's plan". That's what that means.

If "God's plan"
Then "everything is preordained"
I literally said the exact opposite though? It's fine if you believe in preordained fate, that's just my own take.
#9
Masque 22. nov. kl. 19:24 
This is a very, very old debate. Hundreds of years old.

I used to study theological debates in history like this one.

But I don't even care any more. It doesn't even matter.
#10
Houseman 22. nov. kl. 19:24 
Oprindeligt skrevet af Marmarmar34:
I literally said the exact opposite though? It's fine if you believe in preordained fate, that's just my own take.

I'm going off the premises that the OP established.

1. God exists
2. God has a plan
3. Everything happens according to that plan.

I don't care about your opinions, I'm just following OP's logic to its conclusion and answering his question.
#11
hehexd 22. nov. kl. 19:29 
Oprindeligt skrevet af Marmarmar34:
Oprindeligt skrevet af hehexd:
Youre suggesting letting nature run its course would be more in line with god, what if humans resisting nature is in line with gods plan?
Humans are literally of nature though? People dividing us from nature only do that because we currently have the means to reshape what nature even means.
Imo the arts, music, spirituality, technological progress, medicine etc are deeply unnatural but a net good thing. There is zero reason we didnt peak at cavemen other than us wanting to be more than animals, more than nature. There is zero other species like that from what i can see
Sidst redigeret af hehexd; 22. nov. kl. 19:30
#12
Marmarmar34 22. nov. kl. 19:34 
Oprindeligt skrevet af hehexd:
Oprindeligt skrevet af Marmarmar34:
Humans are literally of nature though? People dividing us from nature only do that because we currently have the means to reshape what nature even means.
Imo the arts, music, spirituality, technological progress, medicine etc are deeply unnatural but a net good thing. There is zero reason we didnt peak at cavemen other than us wanting to be more than animals, more than nature. There is zero other species like that from what i can see
Humans being exceptional doesn't remove us from nature, it just puts us in a more optimal position in it. Hell, we could have AI completely wipe out life and be the sole perpetrator of our universe and it would still be of nature.
#13
Jololo 22. nov. kl. 19:38 
Oprindeligt skrevet af hehexd:
Youre suggesting letting nature run its course would be more in line with god, what if humans resisting nature is in line with gods plan?
It is natural for humans to use nature.
And most medicine are just plants and fungus.
#14
hehexd 22. nov. kl. 19:39 
Oprindeligt skrevet af Marmarmar34:
Oprindeligt skrevet af hehexd:
Imo the arts, music, spirituality, technological progress, medicine etc are deeply unnatural but a net good thing. There is zero reason we didnt peak at cavemen other than us wanting to be more than animals, more than nature. There is zero other species like that from what i can see
Humans being exceptional doesn't remove us from nature, it just puts us in a more optimal position in it. Hell, we could have AI completely wipe out life and be the sole perpetrator of our universe and it would still be of nature.
Yeah I dont disagree. Nearly everything is for survival, memetic replication and whatnot.
#15
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