"It's bad." "Rules are being broken." Got it.

Thanks for the feedback. Pox Nora is a complex game with a lot of mechanics, and we are exploring ways of having a more consistent progression curve. It is completely understandable that it would be frustrating to hit a plateau where it feels like you aren't improving and becoming more competitive.

引用自 Senshu：

Thanks for the feedback. Pox Nora is a complex game with a lot of mechanics, and we are exploring ways of having a more consistent progression curve. It is completely understandable that it would be frustrating to hit a plateau where it feels like you aren't improving and becoming more competitive.

Sounds good :D Will 15 rune BGs ever be a thing again? ... or was it 20? I feel like it'd help clear out some of that ability/effects clutter by forcing a more streamlined and balanced build in BGs.

That may not have an ideal change on the game but I think it'd be another way to make the learning curve not so harsh. Seperated 30 and 15 rune BG matching doesn't sound too bad. It'd give newer players a sort of warm up to the more complex part of the game. Even themed builds could be more effective, i imagine.

I actually just watch some of the newer players on Youtube. Of the two, one of them acclimated really well, reading abilities, using a mix of melee and ranged, using spells at the right time, etc.
The other refused to read anything, and kept deploying random champions, random relics, and random spells. He also kept passing the turn (against AI) without moving champions or attacking, like he was playing a mobile game with a ten-second timer. I kind of feel like that's what people expect from games these days: a short timer, and mindless action.
I took another look at the tutorial, but it bugged out on me and is currently unplayable. It seemed alright from what I saw, in its current incarnation, but doesn't show nearly enough of the complexity of the game. Not saying it should smother you, just that if the game is complex, the tutorial should warn you. Though I'm sure guided, video tutorials have been suggested time and time again...

Sorry, I meant more for new players. But yeah, a lot of people don't know how some of these interactions work, and much of the community talks to devs like Sokolov on the forums about clarifying rules text. For example, I had to manually test whether or not illusions proc deployment effects (they do not), and things like using Summon abilities on stealthed-champion-occupied tiles, etc. One of the things I really like about PoxNora is how much of a community game it is, and how they respond to feedback.
Half the time I read threads, I see all sorts of weird, awesome combos I wouldn't even think of, and other people trying to figure out what does and does not constitute an "attack" for the purposes of Bloodthirsty Blade, and so forth. Game's not perfect [yet], but it's far from broken, IMO.

In the end, a far more primary problem, is that poxnora has an average of 20-30 players online at any given time, according to steam's tracking charts. There's just not enough of a playerbase to sustain interestes in the game, especially for new players. Worse, we'd need a massive simultaneous influx of players to fix this problem.

Honestly, i'm surprised the dev's are even still keeping the game going, but i suppose there might be a collectively large enough number of veteran enthusiasts left to milk for cash by releasing new expansion.

In the end though, i have to agree with the OP. The game has grown complex beyond the point of healthiness, especially as many rune abilities, ability interactions and buff priorities and stacking, is not easily evident. In a game with high complexity and low playerbase, trial and error is not a good way to force people to learn their runes. In a setting like this, accurate theorycrafting is necessary. That, currently, is not possible.

A shame, but i can't see this game having a future. If it continues much longer at all, it will likely be because of the aforementioned veteran playerbase.

引用自 The Ironguard：

In the end, a far more primary problem, is that poxnora has an average of 20-30 players online at any given time, according to steam's tracking charts. There's just not enough of a playerbase to sustain interestes in the game, especially for new players. Worse, we'd need a massive simultaneous influx of players to fix this problem.

Honestly, i'm surprised the dev's are even still keeping the game going, but i suppose there might be a collectively large enough number of veteran enthusiasts left to milk for cash by releasing new expansion.

In the end though, i have to agree with the OP. The game has grown complex beyond the point of healthiness, especially as many rune abilities, ability interactions and buff priorities and stacking, is not easily evident. In a game with high complexity and low playerbase, trial and error is not a good way to force people to learn their runes. In a setting like this, accurate theorycrafting is necessary. That, currently, is not possible.

A shame, but i can't see this game having a future. If it continues much longer at all, it will likely be because of the aforementioned veteran playerbase.

Actually the Steam numbers are not correct. Steam only tracks those who are using the Steam version of the game. The standalone version of Pox Nora for PC and Mac is not calculated in the Steam user numbers.

But, getting back to the original point, the game balance is an ongoing endeavor. We also have future plans on increasing accessibility.

引用自 Senshu：

Thanks for the feedback. Pox Nora is a complex game with a lot of mechanics, and we are exploring ways of having a more consistent progression curve. It is completely understandable that it would be frustrating to hit a plateau where it feels like you aren't improving and becoming more competitive.

引用自 l-l：

This video link does appear to be relevant to the issues I mainly have so far with Pox Nora. Hopefully this a working link I don't know for sure.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jVL4st0blGU

It's certainly up to you if you want to watch it. But it does discuss the impact of including a lot of complexity to a game. Maybe it can help others visualize the scale at which an individual user must manage the game itself. Even if is this news is already well known, it is something to remember.

Have you played the board game 'Go'? Less complex but deeper than chess!
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Go_(game)

I have studied 'information display', of which 'marketing is a subset study, which understanding it's integral relationship to psychology leads me to theorize;
that given the large number of concepts and their multifarious interactions with one another -the 'complexity' of PoxNora makes it wholly inaccessible to MOST people.

My assessment is that the presentation of information has been 'The #1 Greatest Inhibitor' to PoxNora's relative success since it's inception.. -other than the already niche game-genre.

Getting more philosophical here.. or simply observing nature, we can know that 'Form' FOLLOWS 'Function' and as the complexity and expansiveness of 'function' increases, due to their fundamental reciprocal relationship, so must the 'form' follow suit and increase it's capacity to express those functions. .
As a city grows in the number of people living there so must the number of roads.

This can LARGELY be mitigated by presenting(revealing ;D) the information in an aesthetically intuitive and modular scheme. With a redesign of the Client, UI and website interactions I can make the game much easier to; start for beginners, learn and expand for newer players, AND to play for veterans.

Here's hoping that PoxNora can somehow or other allocate sufficient funds to present itself in way that makes it a easy pleasure for players to play the great game that it is. Because in it's current iteration it most certainly is not an 'easy pleasure'. I play PoxNora in-spite of all it's inefficiencies and limitations.

Fellow strategists and Battlegroup masters, see you in-game?
~atless

I... don't quite share this sentiment. I started pre-Revamp and found it pretty straightforward. Revamp simplified it more.

Almost all of these issues can be remedied with game awareness. Generally speaking, a "good Pox Nora player" knows which Champions are in play, gets the jist of what they do, watches the Combat Log for Spells, Equipment deploys and other effects, and knows what they want to do with their Champions. Impassable terrain and map objects hiding units is an issue on occasion, and a keybindings tutorial would be nice, though. I usually run an AI game to test most interactions and surrender; the game doesn't tack loss rates versus AI, only campaign victories. (This is also useful for completing Heroic Achievements. Shh!)

from what ive seen the people who enjoy pox are not those who approach it like a chess tournament. strategy gamers should not play TCG games. Period. It only leads to dissapointment. Rather, you should approach it like you would a comic book. You know going in that the story isnt going to be pulitzer prize material, but the concept is cool, the art is cool. You read through it once or twice then add to your collection and hope it will be valuable some day and then go do something else till the next issue.

Because the reality is that Poxnora will never move away from the tcg business model. That means its content driven. Consume the current content, then wait for the next expansion. Dont expect to 'live' in poxnora land like an mmo. And dont expect the game to ever be balanced and bug free. Once you've lowered your expectations down to the comic book level you MIGHT find it enjoyable. The only people who come away from the game bitter are us old addicts who had high hopes for the games potential as the best turn based strategy game around. It cant be that and be content driven at the same time.

imo

the game has been out now for what 9 years? at what point do you realize that there is no 'coming soon'? what you see is what it is. expansions are only the same thing with different cards.

This game is hardcore version of hearthstone. It's so complex, that the skill ceiling goes through the roof, which is what I kind of like and dislike at the same time.

You know what would make this game more enjoyable? Removal of the timer. Just remove the timer like in Frozen Synapse or their newer game (Frozen Cortex), or Hero Academy. It will remove the difficulty completely out of the game, while retaining all the fun aspects, lateral thinking possibilities and making complex but good runes more viable. I might even run Black Ops to determine what kind of a hidden spell my opponent has played, it just takes too long to check.

Youse trollin'!